Falcon better than Taurus?

Brazen · 27-01-2011, 12:15 PM

Full article..

http://news.drive.com.au/drive/motor...127-1a5tq.html

Some selected quotes:

Quote:

We get behind the wheel of the Ford Taurus large car that’s tipped to be sold in Australia.

Ever since Ford let the cat of the bag a couple of weeks ago that the next generation of the Falcon is unlikely to be based on its existing Australian-designed architecture, local eyes have swivelled across the Pacific and settled on a likely successor - America's equivalent, the Taurus....

......Our all-too-brief time with a Taurus Limited model on a short, sweeping loop of Ford's proving ground wasn't enough to draw too many concrete conclusions, apart from one: that the Australian-designed, built and engineered Ford Falcon remains the better car in most respects.....

....The Taurus engine is eager to respond, but lacks the Falcon's welcome oomph under hard acceleration. As with the Falcon, it can become raucous under provocation, but the latter's 4.0-litre V6 has the meatier engine note of the pair....

......I'd take the Falcon's steering any day, though, with its firmer, more reassuring feel. The Taurus's tiller feels too light and lacks bite, even on gentle turn-ins.....

....Looks are highly subjective, but I prefer the Falcon in almost any of its guises to the Taurus's deep hip-line crease, tall doors and curiously raked rear end. Its imposing nose is probably its best angle, and perhaps one we had better get used to, as the writing is on the wall for Falcon.

So the Taurus lands a few body blows, mainly inside the car with its high-tech gadgetry and fresher feel, but the Falcon punches back with power and driveability advantages, firmer steering, as well as a more liveable rear seat.

If it was up to me, I'd pack some of the Taurus's best features into the Falcon chassis for the best of worlds. Are you listening, Ford?

csv8 · 27-01-2011, 12:43 PM

This keeps coming up..there could be more to the Taurus to replace the Falcon. as it keeps coming up???

Brazen · 27-01-2011, 12:44 PM

Yeah I find it interesting that Australian motoring journalists keep being invited to drive the Taurus at the Michigan proving grounds...

XCwillo · 27-01-2011, 12:49 PM

I'm not gonna' lie
I love the new taurus.
As long as they by doing this everyone who owns a 96 model taurus will sell it and get a new one.
Bloody eye sore they are!

nstg8a · 27-01-2011, 12:49 PM

Quote:

....The Taurus engine is eager to respond, but lacks the Falcon's welcome oomph under hard acceleration. As with the Falcon, it can become raucous under provocation, but the latter's 4.0-litre V6 has the meatier engine note of the pair....

im not going to pay any attention to a journo that thinks a falcon has a V6.

R-Design · 27-01-2011, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

Yeah I find it interesting that Australian motoring journalists keep being invited to drive the Taurus at the Michigan proving grounds...

I'm sure Ford would have preferred a different article be written if that were the case. They couldn't get enough time with the Taurus? It's hardly a prototype couldn't they get a rental or go to a dealer. This article raises more questions than gives answers.

Ford_The_Win · 27-01-2011, 12:58 PM

It doesn't look half bad I must admit, and the interior looks good for a yank tank. But if it came down to buying an enormous American FWD or a midsize Japanese FWD, I'd go the Jappa.

**Polyal** · 27-01-2011, 01:06 PM

To me the article reeks of a journo trying to make himself look good by perhaps "predicting" the future. Chances are we will still keep the falcon, albeit revised, and filled with Ford Global DNA and gizmo's.

Its a poo-stiring article written from a guy with nothing factual to report on at the time. Another doomsday journo getting his 5 mins of the limelight, nothing else IMO.

fou_bleu · 27-01-2011, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

To me the article reeks of a journo trying to make himself look good by perhaps "predicting" the future. Chances are we will still keep the falcon, albeit revised, and filled with Ford Global DNA and gizmo's.

Its a poo-stiring article written from a guy with nothing factual to report on at the time. Another doomsday journo getting his 5 mins of the limelight, nothing else IMO.

+1 And as pointed out - a 4 litre V6?

jpd80 · 27-01-2011, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4RD4TW

+1 And as pointed out - a 4 litre V6?

Yep, some journalists definitely have Holdenitis bad.

Latest version of Taurus scored a weight increase, FWD version is 4015 lbs (Fairlane)
and the AWD 4225 lbs (RWD Territory). A lot heavier than our FG Falcon.

I get the feeling that any AWD/FWD car will come from Fusion/Mondeo because that's
where FoA were looking when deciding on FG Falcon or Fusion back in 2004.

IMO, next Falcon should be a RWD version of Fusion / Mondeo so we can have all their
cool versions like Sedan, 5-door hatch and Wagon, and Ute version with current half chassis.
Keep the international top hats and graft the Falcon (or Mustang) firewall and front frame to them.

kiwimark · 27-01-2011, 02:04 PM

For the Taurus what's the point of 4wd in a car like this - it adds weight, uses more gas and doesnt make it any safer to drive (in a real world)

charles_wif_xf · 27-01-2011, 02:12 PM

The term 'motoring journalist' I take very loosely.

Ford Australia have made their decision about where Falcon goes in 2015-16. They would have to simply because they need the four years lead time to do all the legwork and the fart arsing around necessary should manufacturing of it continue here. The thing is, we won't know the future of the platorm (and nameplate) until a lot closer to those dates.

Linkachu · 27-01-2011, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nstg8a

im not going to pay any attention to a journo that thinks a falcon has a V6.

They tend to think any car with 6 cylinders is a V6. They know nothing about cars except talking BS.

MAGPIE · 27-01-2011, 03:24 PM

Best looking Taurus ever

FG has still got it all over the Taurus for looks though.

If they sold them side by side Falcon would get my money every time.

fordOwner · 27-01-2011, 09:31 PM

Just Let Us Build The Flamin Falcon! Geez!

aussie muscle · 28-01-2011, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4RD4TW

+1 And as pointed out - a 4 litre V6?

they must've realised their 'error' and fixed it
[QUOTE]but the latter's 4.0-litre inline six-cylinder has the meatier engine note of the pair. [\QUOTE]

Road_Warrior · 28-01-2011, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csv8

This keeps coming up..there could be more to the Taurus to replace the Falcon. as it keeps coming up???

It keeps coming up because Drivel.com.au keep bringing it up. It's their idea they are trying to keep fresh and relevant.

You've got to wonder why no other motoring media outlet keeps harping on about it??

**Elks** · 28-01-2011, 01:22 PM

I spent some time in the US recently and the new Taurus doesn't look bad in the flesh (metal) although it is typically FWD "nose heavy".

But it would be a HUGE mistake strategically by FORD as they now in real terms have thrown Falcon in with the other large FWD cars such Accord, Mazda 6, Maxima etc. Cars with high equipment levels and excellent build quality without a point of differentiation. A very risky move.

Although I think we all must except that the good old 4.0 six will be replaced by an eco-boost V6 at some point.

Road_Warrior · 28-01-2011, 01:41 PM

The I6 is definitely a goner come 2016. Possibly sooner depending on how the Orion model cycle pans out.

I know they've done testing with a Taurus SHO at You Yangs recently and it is a brilliant car, but in terms of performance and driving dynamics it still doesnt hold a candle to the XR6T.

If it means the I6 has to become the sacrificial goat to keep the Falcon flying as a RWD car (and made here) then so be it. Corporate powertrains and systems are one step toward keeping development costs down and henceforth head office off our back.

JC · 28-01-2011, 01:47 PM

That Taurus even looks like an evolution of the FG Falcon. I reckon if we have to lose the RWD Falcon, the best replacement for it would be the AWD Taurus - leave the FWD to smaller cars.

BDA074 · 28-01-2011, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC

That Taurus even looks like an evolution of the FG Falcon. I reckon if we have to lose the RWD Falcon, the best replacement for it would be the AWD Taurus - leave the FWD to smaller cars.

100% Agree. Would love to keep the RWD Falcon but if it were to go an AWD performance Falcon would be a decent replacement...

**SSD-85** · 28-01-2011, 11:46 PM

Falcon better than Taurus? Its been the same answer for at least 15 years....YES!

Ford US need to just give up & realise the Falcon is the ideal world platform for large passenger sedans. Listen to your people Ford US, we all want the Falcon, not the poptart excuse for a car known as a Taurus.

Falcon chassis, drivetrain & body + Taurus electronics = Epic FTW

jpd80 · 29-01-2011, 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotty85

Falcon better than Taurus? Its been the same answer for at least 15 years....YES!

Ford US need to just give up & realise the Falcon is the ideal world platform for large passenger sedans. Listen to your people Ford US, we all want the Falcon, not the poptart excuse for a car known as a Taurus.

Falcon chassis, drivetrain & body + Taurus electronics = Epic FTW

Problem is that FWD/AWD makes seriously good sense in the USA, this is because the majority of the US population live in the northern "snow States" right next to Canada. In winter driving on icy roads, FWD gives far better handling in low traction situations due to engine weight over driving wheels than can be steered as well.

Now, here's the kicker:
For all the bluster of Taurus being the Ford car of the moment, it sold 68,000 vehicles last year.
Yep, you heard right... and they are taking aim at Falcon's 30,000 sedan sales.

The Ford car that's really selling its head off there is the Fusion with 219,000 vehicles last year.
On a pro rata basis, that would be like Mondeo selling 14,600 vehicles here in Australia (1200/mth)

Guys, all of this so called economy drive... I'm not seeing any real potential to increase Falcon sales
in this country by introducing a FWD/AWD car, the only advantage is sharing the cost of
development and perhaps parts contracts, that would only be maximized if Broady were closed...

I don't want to even contemplate that possibility....

Ford_The_Win · 29-01-2011, 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

Problem is that FWD/AWD makes seriously good sense in the USA, this is because the majority of the US population live in the northern "snow States" right next to Canada. In winter driving on icy roads, FWD gives far better handling in low traction situations due to engine weight over driving wheels than can be steered as well.

Now, here's the kicker:
For all the bluster of Taurus being the Ford car of the moment, it sold 68,000 vehicles last year.
Yep, you heard right... and they are taking aim at Falcon's 30,000 sedan sales.

The Ford car that's really selling its head off there is the Fusion with 219,000 vehicles last year.
On a pro rats basis, that would be like Mondeo selling 14,600 vehicles here in Australia (1200/mth)

Guys, all of this so called economy drive... I'm not seeing any real potential to increase Falcon sales
in this country by introducing a FWD/AWD car, the only advantage is sharing the cost of
development and perhaps parts contracts, that would only be maximized if Broady were closed...

I don't want to even contemplate that possibility....

So they're going to swap one car that's not selling in Aus for a worse car that's not selling in the USA? If Americans aren't even buying it, how bad must the Taurus be? Given that the US population is huge then it must be selling worse than the Falcon is here, per capita.

jpd80 · 29-01-2011, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

So they're going to swap one car that's not selling in Aus for a worse car that's not selling in the USA? If Americans aren't even buying it, how bad must the Taurus be? Given that the US population is huge then it must be selling worse than the Falcon is here, per capita.

I'm not convinced that it's the Taurus.
The last evaluation in 2004 before FoA chose to do FG Falcon was a tight race with Fusion.
Now that I can understand - a Mazda 6 with a 2" x 2" stretch that mostly sells as na I-4
but also has AWD and Duratec V6 engines, the latter combination still lighter than FG.

I think the big challenger will be CD4 Fusion /Mondeo and the potential to increase it
to encompass a Taurus and Falcon replacement. The lure of body styles, numerous engines
including diesels, Hybrid, I-4 Ecoboost and V6 Ecoboost must be absolutely tantelizing to FoA.....

The sweetener for V8 fans would have to be access to the Mustang in RHD,
I think if FoA can get that, a deal with Global FWD/AWd will be sealed.

The other thought is merging power trains and electricals and suspension design with next
gen IRS Mustang to create the next Falcon, that way the two could still be non derivatives
but close relatives without compromising each other's design...a bit like Territory and Falcon....

This is a tough one to call...

388cube_edxr8 · 29-01-2011, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpd80

The other thought is merging power trains and electricals and suspension design with next
gen IRS Mustang to create the next Falcon, that way the two could still be non derivatives
but close relatives without compromising each other's design...a bit like Territory and Falcon....

Why haven't they done this already?! Why replace an Aussie classic with a FWD American barge just because it has a clever radio, when there is a large RWD American sports car aching for some technology that we already have?

You can't tell me that a supercharged V8 or turbo I6 Mustang with a 6 speed (Auto or Manual) and IRS wouldn't sell in the states. Why can't we just stretch the Mustang body over the Falcon floorpan, job done.

I don't care how good the Taurus is (or isn't, as the case may be), I and many others will refuse to pay it any attention based on principle. Ford will lose a lot of followers to the Dark Side with this blatant ignorance of the Strayan Way.

Ford, don't make me buy a Commodore. Don't think I won't!

Halfmo Rocks · 29-01-2011, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 388cube_edxr8

I and many others will refuse to pay it any attention based on principle. Ford will lose a lot of followers to the Dark Side with this blatant ignorance of the Strayan Way.

Ford, don't make me buy a Commodore. Don't think I won't!

yep...if my choices are a FWD/4WD from america wearing a ford badge or buying a RWD aussie car made for the americans...i'll take off my blue shirt & put on a red one. hell, i'd (maybe) rather have a commie with chev badges than have a falcon than is really a taurus

jpd80 · 29-01-2011, 02:16 AM

So what are you guys going to do in the next 12 months / 2 years / 5 years,
buy a brand new FPV V8 or Ford I-6 turbo?

or wait and buy a used one, 12-18 months old and save heaps of cash.

^^^^^ That IMO, is the real problem for Ford.

It's the,
"I'm not paying "48K for an XR8 when I can get one 18 months old for $33K"
That's killing Ford.

Halfmo Rocks · 29-01-2011, 02:35 AM

i'll be up for a new one in about 3 to 3 & 1/2 years (on the term of my current loan, but the last 2 cars i've had never got to the end of the loan before i refinanced & got a something newer)...and i defiantely want to go brand new for the first time.

i dunno about the extra $$$ that come with the FPV over the XR, i most likely just can't justify it, i'll probably go with less bells & whistles to keep the cost down & still buy new.

i've had a I-6 turbo before (BAII ute, in manual), never had a V8...but i know the boost rush is something special. i don't know...time will tell i guess.
in any case i would certainly buy the sports model at least, not the povo pack

FPV GTHO · 29-01-2011, 03:10 AM

When Taurus was still midsized, it was the one selling the high numbers. Ever since Ford announced they would drop it and introduced the Fusion and 500, the Fusion has picked up the sales. When Taurus came back as a large car, its been playing second fiddle. Its no different really to why Fairlane never outsold Falcon. Needless to say comparing sales numbers to population doesnt make one program more viable than the other, they still require the raw numbers irregardless.