AFF Weight Gain/Loss Program

[b0son]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

'Snake Juice' provides essential electrolytes while you are not eating, stops cramps and also ensures your heart and brain and muscles are firing correctly. Saying essential electrolytes are a gimmick is like saying breathing is a gimmick.

Electrolyte replacement is an issue when undertaking prolonged fasts (ie. >2-3 days). If you have a daily eating window, it isn't - you are getting enough from your food. Under normal activity, you simply don't lose enough. Go to a medical text and look up Na/K excretion rates if you don't believe me.

Do you hook yourself up to a saline drip while you sleep?

Sorry but there is no way under any circumstances that I would be drinking Diet Coke or any other diet drink.

Because?

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by b0son

Electrolyte replacement is an issue when undertaking prolonged fasts (ie. >2-3 days). If you have a daily eating window, it isn't - you are getting enough from your food. Under normal activity, you simply don't lose enough. Go to a medical text and look up Na/K excretion rates if you don't believe me.?

I asked about the snake diet, which involves long term fasting.

On an intermitted fasting regime you can probably get away without added electrolytes provided you are mostly sedentary and if you do not drink a lot of water.

Originally Posted by b0son

Do you hook yourself up to a saline drip while you sleep??

No, but I only sleep 6-8 hours at a time, I have on several occasions woken up with bad cramps, especially after days of prolonged activity such as working out on the property on hot days followed by gym sessions.

Drinking water with a specific electrolyte balance throughout the day has resolved the cramps issue instantly.

Originally Posted by b0son

Because?

Do you really have to ask?? Seriously, it tastes like **** to begin with, there are no conceivable benefits to consuming it, and plenty of risk of consuming a chemical cocktail with unknown side effects and long term consequences.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

I asked about the snake diet, which involves long term fasting.

24-48hr is not a long term fast.

I have on several occasions woken up with bad cramps, especially after days of prolonged activity

while on the diet, or generally? aren't you at all concerned that prolonged fasting is counterproductive for someone that is weight-training? you want to be consuming protein no greater than 48hrs post-exercise, though ideally within around 8hrs. similarly for replenishing glycogen post-workout (which spares muscle breakdown) which you aren't doing at all on keto.

Do you really have to ask?? Seriously, it tastes like **** to begin with, there are no conceivable benefits to consuming it, and plenty of risk of consuming a chemical cocktail with unknown side effects and long term consequences.

not much of a chemical cocktail. acesulfame is excreted entirely, aspartame is broken down to metabolizable components. and while there is a supposed risk with some types of caramel, they are lower risks than those associated with frying meats or vegetables.

what studies demonstrate the long term safety of keto diets?

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by b0son

24-48hr is not a long term fast.

A lot longer than what 99.9% of the population fast

Originally Posted by b0son

aren't you at all concerned that prolonged fasting is counterproductive for someone that is weight-training?

What makes you say it's counter productive? Fasting increases growth hormone, is muscle sparing and fat burning, all desirable things when weight training.

Originally Posted by b0son

not much of a chemical cocktail. acesulfame is excreted entirely, aspartame is broken down to metabolizable components. and while there is a supposed risk with some types of caramel, they are lower risks than those associated with frying meats or vegetables.

What risk is there in frying meat and vegetables?? Never heard of this unless you are referring to some outdated incorrectly conducted study done back in the day.

Originally Posted by b0son

what studies demonstrate the long term safety of keto diets?

What studies demonstrate a long term danger or risk factor of Keto diets?

[b0son]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

A lot longer than what 99.9% of the population fast

Physiology doesn't change depending on how many people are doing something. 24-48hrs is not a long term fast WRT needing to replace electrolytes for most people.

What makes you say it's counter productive? Fasting increases growth hormone, is muscle sparing and fat burning, all desirable things when weight training.

High intensity weight training engages the anaerobic/alactic system, which is powered by creatine/glycogen. Training in a fasted state (ie. one in which glycogen is depleted) increases the likelihood of catabolism, and reduces the scale of the adaptive response to training. Your power output on fat is significantly less than on glycogen (around a third less), and is why distance runners 'hit the wall', they transition from glycogen to fat.

What risk is there in frying meat and vegetables?? Never heard of this

Maillard reaction generates advanced glycation end-products, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, nitrosamines. All linked to cancer. Loads of research on it.

What studies demonstrate a long term danger or risk factor of Keto diets?

You're the one who criticised the risk of doing something with unknown side effects and long term consequences. If you're going to have a go at me for drinking something that hasn't been demonstrated to be unsafe, it seems only fair to do the same re: keto.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by b0son

Maillard reaction generates advanced glycation end-products, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, nitrosamines. All linked to cancer. Loads of research on it

Loads of flawed and incorrect research done on it, no conclusive research that shows even a remote link to humans. Don't believe everything you see on a Currant Affair on TV.

From the National Institute of Cancer:

'Studies have shown that exposure to HCAs and PAHs can cause cancer in rodents. In many experiments, rodents fed a diet supplemented with HCAs developed tumors of the breast, colon, liver, skin, lung, prostate, and other organs. Rodents fed PAHs also developed cancers, including leukemia and tumors of the gastrointestinal tract and lungs. However, the doses of HCAs and PAHs used in these studies were very high—equivalent to thousands of times the doses that a person would consume in a normal diet.

Population studies have not established a link between HCA and PAH exposure from cooked meats and cancer in humans. '

So in conclusions don't feed your pet rats huge amounts of charred meat.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Loads of flawed and incorrect research done on it, no conclusive research that shows even a remote link to humans. Don't believe everything you see on a Currant Affair on TV.

You do get why they cant get ethics approval to feed people potentially genotoxic substances, right? I'm not sure what your basis is for concluding most of the research is flawed and incorrect, beyond your own inherent bias.

Population studies have not established a link between HCA and PAH exposure from cooked meats and cancer in humans.

But they have established a link between processed and red meat consumption and cancer. The funny part is that as more people move to a vegan diet or plant-based diet, and as more processed foods go vegan, I suspect the health outcomes for those people will also get worse. It probably isn't so much what you eat, but how you eat it.