VFACTS July 2013

[BroadyFord]

Preliminary numbers out:

Falcon just 594 units. Interesting to see if they'll bail before 2016.

Commodore had a good month - almost 3000 units.

FBT changes look like they'll hit in next month's figures.

Full story below:

http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and...ng_car_in_july

[FalconXV]

Originally Posted by BroadyFord

Preliminary numbers out:

Falcon just 594 units. Interesting to see if they'll bail before 2016.

Commodore had a good month - almost 3000 units.

FBT changes look like they'll hit in next month's figures.

Full story below:

http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and...ng_car_in_july

What sort of monthly numbers would make them shut early?
Aren't they running at a loss anyway?
You'd think they'd have some down weeks/months but at least give the FH a shot.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Depends what Territory was doing and Falcon ute...

Depends how much future supply they have locked in.

[EDManual]

Obviously Ford are wanting to sell as little as possible. More they sell the more they lose perhaps? That's why they don't advertise. ...

[GT014]

A few more months of that and gives Ford an excuse to close early saying, 'we tried'

Aug 13 event is going to be interesting.

[Spammy]

Hang on -- wasn't every dealer reporting a massive influx of Falcon enquiries?

[bobthebilda]

Preliminary numbers out:

Falcon just 594 units. Interesting to see if they'll bail before 2016.

The company I work for have told everyone that from now on, company vehicles will be Camry / Aurions instead of the current falcons. It wont take many companies making the same decision to make 500 plus Falcons a month look like a good sales month.

Commodore had a good month - almost 3000 units.

In what perpective. That they sold 450 more commodores last month than they did in July 2012. I think with sub 3000 sales a month, Mike Deveraux would be buying wigs, just so he could pull his hair out.

[Rob 351]

Almost 3000 for Commodore must be a worry for Holden. Imo they needed to be double that with the new VF. 600 for the FG, hope the ute & Tezza had better numbers otherwise I have grave concerns for the Falcon seeing 2016.
Still can't beleive the lack of VF sales....especially on how much they have advertised it!!

[vztrt]

Commodore figures aren't good. The number includes wagon which was inflating VE sales when the wagon was launched.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by EDManual

Obviously Ford are wanting to sell as little as possible. More they sell the more they lose perhaps? That's why they don't advertise. ...

It's also based on what dealers want to stock, at the moment its SFA Falcons,
most of them prefer to stock Ranger, Focus, Kuga and Fiesta

[burnz]

whats wrong with the sales?
2400 (2012) commo
2800 (2013) commo

1875 (2012) cruze
2465 (2013) cruze

8936 (2012) total
10135 (2013) total

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by jpd80

It's also based on what dealers want to stock, at the moment its SFA Falcons,
most of them prefer to stock Ranger, Focus, Kuga and Fiesta

Perhaps the dealers want to stock the models that are selling rather than the models that gather dust?

[jpd80]

There's a big difference,

Nearly all of those Commodore sales are V8s

[GTP owner]

The way I see it is that Ford and Holden failed the buying public by building cars they no longer want. People do not want a bigger car with every new cycle. They dont want more power at the expense of fuel economy. They dont want more of the same.

Both companies needed to downsize the local car significantly. The Holden could have called it the Torana - made it rear wheel drive, V8 as an option, weighing less then 1500kg and just smaller then the cruze. Ford could have called it a Peregrine and made it the size of the Focus - less than 1500kg, V6 motors or V8 option, rear wheel drive, and pack it with tacky electronics that the general public love. Ipod connectivity, sat nav, reversing camera, disco balls, whatever the public think makes a car good. It works for hyundai, so it should work for the local boys.

But unfortunately both manufacturers failed to see the warning signs and continued to build behemoths. Cadillac - built behemoths and died. Desoto - the same. And there are a dozen others who suffered the same fate. Why are the managers so stupid to see the mistakes made by others and be proactive? Remember when the VC commodore replaced the kingswood? Everyone thought it was madness, yet it was the start of a great winning streak by holden. Ford? Nope - it gave us the XF, which sold plenty but heralded the beginning of the end. If only they broke new ground and made the next model smaller.....

End of rant

[FalconXV]

Surely an early exit would be a PR nightmare, and something to avoid?

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by FalconXV

Surely an early exit would be a PR nightmare, and something to avoid?

And their current strategy has been a PR dream?

[Spammy]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

T

Cadillac - built behemoths and died.

End of rant

Really ? I thought Caddy was/is one of the oldest and longest running names in the industry

[GTP owner]

Originally Posted by Spammy

Really ? I thought Caddy was/is one of the oldest and longest running names in the industry

whoops, so it does!

[Smoke Pursuit]

Why would Holden be stressed... They cant supply enough... The 3000 sales does not take into account exports....

Will take months for Holden to get their supply levels right, its a new mix to them at the pricing and no doubt they will see SV6 buyers looking at SS etc due to the reduction in pricing.

[Cuyper]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

The way I see it is that Ford and Holden failed the buying public by building cars they no longer want. People do not want a bigger car with every new cycle. They dont want more power at the expense of fuel economy. They dont want more of the same.

Both companies needed to downsize the local car significantly. The Holden could have called it the Torana - made it rear wheel drive, V8 as an option, weighing less then 1500kg and just smaller then the cruze. Ford could have called it a Peregrine and made it the size of the Focus - less than 1500kg, V6 motors or V8 option, rear wheel drive, and pack it with tacky electronics that the general public love. Ipod connectivity, sat nav, reversing camera, disco balls, whatever the public think makes a car good. It works for hyundai, so it should work for the local boys.

But unfortunately both manufacturers failed to see the warning signs and continued to build behemoths. Cadillac - built behemoths and died. Desoto - the same. And there are a dozen others who suffered the same fate. Why are the managers so stupid to see the mistakes made by others and be proactive? Remember when the VC commodore replaced the kingswood? Everyone thought it was madness, yet it was the start of a great winning streak by holden. Ford? Nope - it gave us the XF, which sold plenty but heralded the beginning of the end. If only they broke new ground and made the next model smaller.....

End of rant

Could of, should of... Most of us could see they needed to 10 years ago. But they didn't, pity such an obvious and easy decision was overlooked at the cost of two great companies. Holden still have a chance to fix the situation but they would want to hurry up and get a decent base model engine in the VF II, then downsize the car itself for the next model.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

The way I see it is that Ford and Holden failed the buying public by building cars they no longer want. People do not want a bigger car with every new cycle. They dont want more power at the expense of fuel economy. They dont want more of the same.

Both companies needed to downsize the local car significantly. The Holden could have called it the Torana - made it rear wheel drive, V8 as an option, weighing less then 1500kg and just smaller then the cruze. Ford could have called it a Peregrine and made it the size of the Focus - less than 1500kg, V6 motors or V8 option, rear wheel drive, and pack it with tacky electronics that the general public love. Ipod connectivity, sat nav, reversing camera, disco balls, whatever the public think makes a car good. It works for hyundai, so it should work for the local boys.

But unfortunately both manufacturers failed to see the warning signs and continued to build behemoths. Cadillac - built behemoths and died. Desoto - the same. And there are a dozen others who suffered the same fate. Why are the managers so stupid to see the mistakes made by others and be proactive? Remember when the VC commodore replaced the kingswood? Everyone thought it was madness, yet it was the start of a great winning streak by holden. Ford? Nope - it gave us the XF, which sold plenty but heralded the beginning of the end. If only they broke new ground and made the next model smaller.....

End of rant

why would GM or Ford re tool the aussie plants, that are expensive to keep open, only to make a car the same size as one that is already made elsewhere in their respective empires?

they may as well do what they are doing and just close the plants and bring in more of their global line up. i believe malibu is coming, as will fusion etc.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Why would Holden be stressed... They cant supply enough... The 3000 sales does not take into account exports....

Will take months for Holden to get their supply levels right, its a new mix to them at the pricing and no doubt they will see SV6 buyers looking at SS etc due to the reduction in pricing.

Just like Ford couldn't make enough? They would make more if they had the sales. With V8s totalling over 40% of sales, Holden should be shaking in their boots. Once the enthusiasts have their V8, you are left with a Commodore struggling to sell 1500 per month and it will only get worse.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

The way I see it is that Ford and Holden failed the buying public by building cars they no longer want. People do not want a bigger car with every new cycle. They dont want more power at the expense of fuel economy. They dont want more of the same.

Both companies needed to downsize the local car significantly. The Holden could have called it the Torana - made it rear wheel drive, V8 as an option, weighing less then 1500kg and just smaller then the cruze. Ford could have called it a Peregrine and made it the size of the Focus - less than 1500kg, V6 motors or V8 option, rear wheel drive, and pack it with tacky electronics that the general public love. Ipod connectivity, sat nav, reversing camera, disco balls, whatever the public think makes a car good. It works for hyundai, so it should work for the local boys.

But unfortunately both manufacturers failed to see the warning signs and continued to build behemoths. Cadillac - built behemoths and died. Desoto - the same. And there are a dozen others who suffered the same fate. Why are the managers so stupid to see the mistakes made by others and be proactive? Remember when the VC commodore replaced the kingswood? Everyone thought it was madness, yet it was the start of a great winning streak by holden. Ford? Nope - it gave us the XF, which sold plenty but heralded the beginning of the end. If only they broke new ground and made the next model smaller.....

End of rant

VC the start of a winning streak? Going small almost crippled Holden in the 80s. All this revisionist history that Ford struggled is unbelievable. The decision to stay big helped Ford topple Holden through the 80s and up to the mid 90s.

Now is a very different time.

[GTP owner]

Originally Posted by P6LTD351

VC the start of a winning streak? Going small almost crippled Holden in the 80s. All this revisionist history that Ford struggled is unbelievable. The decision to stay big helped Ford topple Holden through the 80s and up to the mid 90s.

Now is a very different time.

It was a short term pain that laid the foundations for a boom period, much the same as the XF marked the progressive decline of the falcon.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by GTP owner

It was a short term pain that laid the foundations for a boom period, much the same as the XF marked the progressive decline of the falcon.

What boom period? When Holden made the Commodore large again to compete with the Falcon?

XF was the most successful Falcon in history - and without a V8. The general public don't buy V8s for their daily.

If the XF marked the end, how was the EF, a decade later, the #1 selling car in Australia?

[Polyal]

Sorry how is 3000 per month bad?

[PepeLePew]

I'm a fence sitter and the colour of my blood is just plain human. I've taken a good look at VF and while gadgetry may bring sales the sedan if anything, IMHO, just doesn't look as refined as VE. VE's been around so long we're bored of it, BUT, it deserved it's lifespan. It's well resolved. I'm not sure the front and rear ends of VF bear any relationship to each other. All the hallmarks of a final model with enough hints of the global products replacing it to slide easily from Commodore to.....???? Me thinks Holden know the writing is on the wall and have already rolled out the carpet to the next generation of offshore imports.

[P6LTD351]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Sorry how is 3000 per month bad?

How is 2825 good for the first new model in 7 years AND with a large amount of them being V8s?

Spin it anyway you like, Holden would be worried.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by P6LTD351

How is 2825 good for the first new model in 7 years AND with a large amount of them being V8s?

Spin it anyway you like, Holden would be worried.

Im not spinning anything, when was the last time the Falcon was there?

I think the VF looks like an overgrown Epica but that doesnt change the fact that any car selling 3000 per month should be pretty happy and given we are as good as in a recession then I think its fricken good.

Where is the next best car like it?

[Spammy]

The reality is there is no single car sold in Australia that can justify its existence if it was only sold here.

The Mazda3 and Corolla sell 3500 to 4000 units each - big whoop ...think about how many they sell world wide each month. Back in the good old days when Aussies really only had limited choices Falcon/Kingas and Commodores could survive... but with however many brands and unlimited models and sub-categories of cars, a main steam car that sells small numbers is pointless.

The reason the Falcon is over (Commo prob won't be far behind it) is because they don't have a sales footprint that makes sense.

They could have made them bigger / smaller / rounder / squarer whatever would not have made any difference to the outcome.