Towing a Caravan - Mechanical strain etc

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

VW says it's 80 (or maybe) 90 Kgs.

I'm not worried as the R36 so stiff suspension it was barely noticable as Caravan (1400kgs) even was there unless braking down hill. (still fine just needed to more space and be cautious)

Again, told ball weight illegal and I don't want to hurt anyone due to my lack of knowledge in towing.

Thanks all.

Go talk to a tow bar manufacturer such as Hayman Reese or any other local one in your area as they may be able to fit an aftermarket one with a higher tow ball rating.
Worth a try.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Officemanager

Go talk to a tow bar manufacturer such as Hayman Reese or any other local one in your area as they may be able to fit an aftermarket one with a higher tow ball rating.
Worth a try.

tow ball rating doesn't override the manufacturer limits. aftermarket tow kits do often have their own ratings, but the ones that are legal are the LOWER of the two (manufacturer v aftermarket).

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by prydey

tow ball rating doesn't override the manufacturer limits. aftermarket tow kits do often have their own ratings, but the ones that are legal are the LOWER of the two (manufacturer v aftermarket).

Been done before with other vehicles so I suggest you do your home work.
I'm not saying they will do all vehicles but worth asking.
Cheers

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by Officemanager

Go talk to a tow bar manufacturer such as Hayman Reese or any other local one in your area as they may be able to fit an aftermarket one with a higher tow ball rating.
Worth a try.

Mine is Haymen Reece mate.

It's top quality and previous owner towed a big boat no worries.

It's just this stupid tiny tow ball weight issue that's cropped up and it's VW stipulated not HR.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Mine is Haymen Reece mate.

It's top quality and previous owner towed a big boat no worries.

It's just this stupid tiny tow ball weight issue that's cropped up and it's VW stipulated not HR.

If the manufacturer has stipulated a low ball weight maximum rating then it probably means the rear suspension/axle can't handle the load or the way the towbar is mounted to the car can't handle the load. Given it has a tow rating of over 2t (if i read correctly earlier in the thread) then it probably has something to do with the rear axle load rating. Unfortunately, unless VW offer some kind of 'upgrade' in this regard, then you are stuck with looking for a van that meets this rating.

Your best bet is to look at euro vans. most euro vans are designed to work with a much lighter ball weight. also check your owners manual as well as it wouldn't surprise me if VW also stipulate that a weight distribution hitch is used. This just spreads some of the load to the front axle and a bit back to the van axle.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Mine is Haymen Reece mate.

It's top quality and previous owner towed a big boat no worries.

It's just this stupid tiny tow ball weight issue that's cropped up and it's VW stipulated not HR.

Just trying to offer a solution.
Cheers

[dunga]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

If you are worried about excessive ball weight fit a weight distribution kit.How big is the van and did said dealer tell you what the ball weight is

waste of time wdh doesn't alter tow ball weight.

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by dunga

waste of time wdh doesn't alter tow ball weight.

Of course it does,otherwise why use them

[dunga]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

Of course it does,otherwise why use them

go and do some research.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

Of course it does,otherwise why use them

They restore weight to the front axle. That is their primary purpose. By doing so it also takes some weight off the rear axle and puts a little more on the van axle.

Ball weight remains the same.

They are not a solution to an overloaded rear axle and should only be tensioned to restore around 50% of the lost weight from the front axle.

[dunga]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

Of course it does,otherwise why use them

From cars guide 8 towing myths.

A weight distribution hitch (WDH) is a wonderful device which does exactly what its name implies. Its powerful leveraging effect provides a better distribution of weight across all axles resulting in a level ride height for tow vehicle and trailer, which is particularly important in maintaining effective steering and front wheel braking in the tow vehicle. However, just because a WDH’s leveraging effect (often compared to raising the long handles of a wheelbarrow) allows this ride levelling to occur, the amount of weight on the tow-ball prior to fitting the WDH does not change.

[MercuryT]

TassieF100.

Caravan weight 1450. Only a small Rayco.

Tow ball weight 150.

[Crazy Dazz]

As others have said, check the regs in your state.
10% is usually the maximumrecommended, with a range of 5~10%.
Provided the suspension and towhitch are up to it, I prefer to overload the hitch, but only for extremely big loads.
How much does your Passat weigh? If the van is under 75%, AND has good electric brakes, then you could rebalance it down to 80kg which would still be above 5%.

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

As others have said, check the regs in your state.
10% is usually the maximumrecommended, with a range of 5~10%.
Provided the suspension and towhitch are up to it, I prefer to overload the hitch, but only for extremely big loads.
How much does your Passat weigh? If the van is under 75%, AND has good electric brakes, then you could rebalance it down to 80kg which would still be above 5%.

Psssat about 1800kgs but has a higher towing rating than lower models due to it being the top.

Ok cool I'll look further into it. The bloody VW Tiguan has a higher rated towball weight and nowhere near as good for towing.

Maybe I'm being overly cautious just never heard of this tow ball weight etc which basically ruins it's ability to tow anything (despite a pretty high braked capacity at 2200kg)

[Tassie f100]

If you are prepared to run the very minimal risk of something going wrong the go would be to hook the caravan on and see how the level looks.Maybe measure the height of the towbar before and after.Anywhere up to 50mm difference would be quite acceptable.Don’t know what the legalities are if you are caught out with too much tow ball weight,but no one is going to check it if the caravan and towbar are level.If you use load levellers the towbar will be the same height loaded or unloaded

[dunga]

Originally Posted by Tassie f100

If you are prepared to run the very minimal risk of something going wrong the go would be to hook the caravan on and see how the level looks.Maybe measure the height of the towbar before and after.Anywhere up to 50mm difference would be quite acceptable.Don’t know what the legalities are if you are caught out with too much tow ball weight,but no one is going to check it if the caravan and towbar are level.If you use load levellers the towbar will be the same height loaded or unloaded

Only ones that will check is the crash investigators and the insurance company. Buy a suitable car or a European caravan.

[MercuryT]

Told today by Caravan place as "no problem at all" and R36 tow a small van easily. Tow ball weight irrelevant at such low levels of weight (1400kgs braked)

In fact the low hard suspension a bonus as less rocking on the the caravan as it's hard as and when attached a van it barely squated at all. Maybe a cm or so.

Yet Euro tow ball weights regularly set ridiculously low.

So yeah.....do what others do or adhere strictly to stupid limits (it used to tow a 2 tonne boat no worries)

[prydey]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Told today by Caravan place as "no problem at all" and R36 tow a small van easily. Tow ball weight irrelevant at such low levels of weight (1400kgs braked)

In fact the low hard suspension a bonus as less rocking on the the caravan as it's hard as and when attached a van it barely squated at all. Maybe a cm or so.

Yet Euro tow ball weights regularly set ridiculously low.

So yeah.....do what others do or adhere strictly to stupid limits (it used to tow a 2 tonne boat no worries)

Not good advice from the caravan salesperson. Sounds like one of these guys that just wants a sale.

Euro ball weights are lower but often they are often used in conjunction with an anti sway device, if the van doesn't have one incorporated.

There are lots of small Euro vans out there that will suit you AND keep you legal.

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by prydey

There are lots of small Euro vans out there that will suit you AND keep you legal.

How small?

Weigh 750kgs?

Cant say I've seen many (if ever)

[prydey]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

How small?

Weigh 750kgs?

Cant say I've seen many (if ever)

Not that small. As mentioned, European vans are often designed to run around 5% ball weight. They are reasonably light as well. You could find a van around 1.5t that should suit your requirements. As long as it's correctly set up it should be fine.

Get on caravansales.com.au and have a search.

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by prydey

Not that small. As mentioned, European vans are often designed to run around 5% ball weight. They are reasonably light as well. You could find a van around 1.5t that should suit your requirements. As long as it's correctly set up it should be fine.

Get on caravansales.com.au and have a search.

Mate the Van I want is 1400kgs.

10% is 140. My bar says 90kg. (2200 braked vehicle)

Hence I can't get it (according to here, others say no problem at all like Tassie F100

[Tassie f100]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

How small?

Weigh 750kgs?

Cant say I've seen many (if ever)

Probably the best small van around that weight would be the Avan A frame fold down.Around 3.5 metres long 750-800 kg, different interior layouts,as in either single bed each end or double at rear.Great litle van,but not real cheap.

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Told today by Caravan place as "no problem at all" and R36 tow a small van easily. Tow ball weight irrelevant at such low levels of weight (1400kgs braked)

In fact the low hard suspension a bonus as less rocking on the the caravan as it's hard as and when attached a van it barely squated at all. Maybe a cm or so.

Yet Euro tow ball weights regularly set ridiculously low.

So yeah.....do what others do or adhere strictly to stupid limits (it used to tow a 2 tonne boat no worries)

Tell him to put that in writing from company letter, sign the document and hand it to you.... let me guess he won't do that!

Cheers.

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by Officemanager

Tell him to put that in writing from company letter, sign the document and hand it to you.... let me guess he won't do that!

Cheers.

Maybe not but it's towed a 2 tonne boat before my ownership no worries so I'm getting frustrated on these technicalities that don't seem real at all.

[Pis-ton broke]

i,m not sure of your year but i googled r36 passat tow capacity and got this.
https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C...sclient=psy-ab

and
https://www.carsguide.com.au/volkswa...-capacity/2009
understand that unbraked is with NO brake assist for trailer, so this limits you to 750kg
if you have have electric or hydraulic brakes then the tow capacity is greatly increased. but i quickly looked at those numbers and they look to match or close to your caravan.

the 2009 r36 has a maximum braked capacity of 2200kg.(you install and electric brake controller in the car) .
if your van is 1400kg , your well under the maximum limit.

[MercuryT]

As previous mate my handbook says 2200 braked.

The towbar itself itself says 1500 braked (Haymen Reece)

The Tow ball limit is 85 0r something stupid which is causing all the problems.

I have no doubt it will pull a 1400kg van easily. Legally I was told I can't as Euro cars rate towbal capacity very low

[Pis-ton broke]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

As previous mate my handbook says 2200 braked.

The towbar itself itself says 1500 braked (Haymen Reece)

The Tow ball limit is 85 0r something stupid which is causing all the problems.

I have no doubt it will pull a 1400kg van easily. Legally I was told I can't as Euro cars rate towbal capacity very low

ok, sorry, i,m up to speed now.
to me i doesn,t make sense, the car can tow 2.2t with a ball weight of 90kg, thats less than 5% of 2200kg.

imo, at least 10% ball weight would be safer than 5% for towing, in fact some float manufactures would set there axles further to the rear of the trailer in a effort to aid towing balance. in contrast, a finely balanced trailer is more likely to dance around behind the car, possibly aiding a jack knife situation. european roads are better so that will help the trailer - car balance.

i think its good that your trying to figure it out, i towed horse floats for 30+ years and in all that time, me and no one else used to check ball weights, and the police didn,t check either.
but that didn,t mean we didn,t care, as we knew what that falcons could take, load wise. horse owners would always chat and compare how well there floats would tow, and float and car towing combinations.

if i was in your shoes , i would tow the van.
if your concern for ball weight ,you can internal adjust ball weight by moving weight around in the van, forwards or rearwards, or add a water tank. i did say before, buy a towbar weight tester. i still don,t own one.
https://www.campsmart.net.au/tow-bal...kaAhp2EALw_wcB

https://www.towbars2u.com.au/passat

[hayseed]

Buy one of these..

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/TOWSAFE-...frcectupt=true

Go & see what the Actual Ball weight is of the van..
Maybe if you Load all your Luggage ect to the rear of the Van, You'll be able to get It down to 90Kgs...

[MercuryT]

Originally Posted by hayseed

Buy one of these..

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/TOWSAFE-...frcectupt=true

Go & see what the Actual Ball weight is of the van..
Maybe if you Load all your Luggage ect to the rear of the Van, You'll be able to get It down to 90Kgs...

Actual ball weight of the Van is 150kgs.

The seller then advised he couldn't sell it to me (fine).

Then the local towing company said that's nonsense and at 1450kgs braked my car would pull it easily and tow ball weight vastly underrated and it's never checked anyway.

Hence I'm so confused.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by MercuryT

Hence I'm so confused.

You want to drive a Passat AND tow a Caravan. I'm starting to see a pattern...