Australian Drivers Are Ignoring LPG

[PepeLePew]

I could write a essay on why I like LPG on my cars. I was nervous even thinking about it. The rebate, my excessive km's, and its love of the turbo is what sold me. Most of all, the turbo. But once I was in, the Terri soon followed. I spin the joys of my LPG existence daily, but I dont note all my mates converting. The Aussie public around me has too much fear and misunderstanding of the fuel, and the things in their faces (e-gas, mixed experiences of aftermarket conversions, LACK of knowledge of the newer systems) more than override my meanderings.

The LPG industry doesnt help itself. Its lousy at promoting the newer technologies and how much better they are. And is anybody listening and believing with the mixed reputation of the industry? The lack of regulation in installers is a nightmare. Mainstream manufacturers (Ford/Holden to be clear) offering quality new breed systems will go a long way to changing that perceptions. Salesmen throwing the keys to people not looking for LPG and the subsequent drive experience will help educate people better than anything the aftermarket can say anyway.....

I said all that but Im still waiting for this thread to turn into a LI vs SVI vs Mixer as its threatening to....

[Mr Hardware]

gee dave, i'm beginning to think my egas is a freak car going by your constant bagging of it.

Ignore the troll, he's a card-carrying e-gas hater. To him it's all theory and no practical, like proclaiming there's nothing wrong with a LED fuel guage.

many of the replies to this thread show why lpg is struggling to take off

quite right, and they can be put in the four main myth categories of which i outlined on page 1. the only legitimate downside to LPG is the space for the tank issue, of which most people overestimate grossly. I recently went on a week-long road trip with the good wife and managed to fit all our luggage in the boot of my cylinder-tanked AU without a hitch.

[gtfpv]

so much complete BS here on the old mixer system being terrible rubbish . they simply arew not . i've had them for 20 years now on 3 different ford each getting over 400 000kms . with hardly any engine maintenance whatsoever . i've towed boats , driven in all weather , thrashed etc etc . had way less problems than you would expect on petrol .

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

so much complete BS here on the old mixer system being terrible rubbish .

It's true. It's true.!!

We've had our Barge on Gas -Impco- for the last 4 years (appx 60,000kms) and in that time we've had to replace...
A full set of tyres.
Two batteries.
A few oil changes.
One set of plugs and leads (30,000 kms ago)
One air filter.

AND I still have to put gas in it weekly!!


This reminds me, I must get the free 1,000km service done soon.

[prydey]

people generally pass verdict based on personal experience. i had an el wagon on duel fuel with an 'elko' system. based on that experience, i said i would never own another gas car as long as i live. i now own a bf2 egas. the decision to buy an egas was made easier when a couple of years ago my brother bought an au egas wagon. that was the total opposite to my previous experience.

i would still be a bit dubious about another dual fuel car but i think a lot of issues don't come from the 'type' of system, but from the 'installer/setup' of the system.

the beauty of liquid injection is it intercepts the signals from the factory ecu. this eliminates a lot of the issues with other gas systems, including vapour.

[z80]

Originally Posted by prydey

the beauty of liquid injection is it intercepts the signals from the factory ecu. this eliminates a lot of the issues with other gas systems, including vapour.

Vapour Injection does exactly the same thing now.


The only thing to watch out for now is when you get a bad batch of gas it can block your MAP sensor(s).

An inline filter on the vaccuum line fixes that.

[PepeLePew]

Originally Posted by z80

Vapour Injection does exactly the same thing now.


The only thing to watch out for now is when you get a bad batch of gas it can block your MAP sensor(s).

An inline filter on the vaccuum line fixes that.

Vapour injection reads the signal then applies whatever timing/mapping is tuned into the ECU to it. LI uses the signal to fire the injectors without this interpretation/tuning in the middle.

Im not sure thats why Australians are ignoring LPG though.

[Thankfull]

Well I am currently waiting on a well sorted fuel efficent direct injection LPG V8 by Ford to go into production at Geelong in 2010.

We are going to buy one......

[Falcon Coupe]

MO and ILLaViTaR, your discussion is not helping the topic, take it to pm please.

[brenx]

The older systems were expensive to maintain due to the way the filter setup was. Now with screw on filters LPG couldn't be easier IMO. I know if I buy a large car it will be on gas.

[TURBOTAXI]

Clearly I love LPG, I have two turbo falcons on LPG and get fantastic economy.
My mother is 65 and is always flat out with work. She bought an EL Fairlane a few years back with 112k and has just hit 320k Its on LPG of course.

Its a choice thing, its a bit like investing, people know they should do SOMETHING to secure their future/improve their financial situation, but the percentage of people who actually go out and do something is surprisingly small.

People tend to take the path of least resistance, and most of the time only do what needs to be done to minimise discomfort. If they are managing to meet committments buying petrol they are less likely to do anything about it.

I dont really care if more people go to LPG, I know I save a motza with about 55,000k's per years between the two cars.

[Stoney!]

Can't say I am a massive fan of LPG either, small capacity turbo and diesel all the way.

Stoney!

[Road_Warrior]

[QUOTE=TURBOTAXI]
Its a choice thing, its a bit like investing, people know they should do SOMETHING to secure their future/improve their financial situation, but the percentage of people who actually go out and do something is surprisingly small.

/QUOTE]

Which is why I had my car gas converted. I want to try to minimise my family's exposure to petrol/oil as much as I can and LPG was a good way to start.

[Mr Hardware]

Can't say I am a massive fan of LPG either, small capacity turbo and diesel all the way

And if you added LPG Fumigation to that, it'd go quicker, the turbo spin up sooner and you'd get better economy and less sooting. LPG IS MAGIC

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

And if you added LPG Fumigation to that, it'd go quicker, the turbo spin up sooner and you'd get better economy and less sooting. LPG IS MAGIC

mag⋅ic

–noun 1. the art of producing illusions as entertainment by the use of sleight of hand, deceptive devices, etc.; legerdemain; conjuring: to pull a rabbit out of a hat by magic

ref: www.dictionary.com

[PepeLePew]

Originally Posted by flappist

mag⋅ic

–noun 1. the art of producing illusions as entertainment by the use of sleight of hand, deceptive devices, etc.; legerdemain; conjuring: to pull a rabbit out of a hat by magic

ref: www.dictionary.com

Sorry flap I usually see eye to eye with you but magic, in my opinion, is a thread appearing in the LPG forum or LPG related that doesnt end up as a petrol/LPG and/or mixer/SVI/LI bunfight with a lock on it.

[Stoney!]

Originally Posted by Mr Hardware

And if you added LPG Fumigation to that, it'd go quicker, the turbo spin up sooner and you'd get better economy and less sooting. LPG IS MAGIC

The Economy and performance of small capacity turbo's (including VW's 'magic' Twin charger engine) and Turbo Diesel is sufficient enough without giving up my spare wheel or boot space thanks.

You might wanna replace economy, with value, cause I certainly wouldn't get the same distance on a tank of LPG compared to similar sized tank of diesel.

Fuels all have their pro's and Con's.... I suppose it doens't help that a lot of manufacturers don't offer it from the factory, and its something that is generally aftermarket.

I and I'm sure other people fear that taking your car back to your manufacturer for warranty work might be a bit harder cause things could be blamed on the LPG system, either when it is or isn't. The biggest problem here is either manufacturer faults being covered up. That or just the fact that as a common car driver and not knowing what might be wrong, you can't just take the golf back to VW and say fix it, you may need to then take it back the the conversion place. Then it just becomes annoying.

Some companies may even void you warranty, and I think VW is one of these, yet on the same table, VW tell their driver not to you bio-diesel or home made bio-diesel but no case yet has seen warranty voided for this.

I wanna buy a car, not have to get anything fitted aftermarket, take it back to the one place for warranty repairs without feer of them saying no, with both power and economy, so I bought the twin charger golf!

And I think a lot of other people buying diesels or small capacity turbos are seeing it this way also. The 1.4 turbo headed for the Holden Cruze will only make it more popular still.

Stoney!

[NC 5ltr]

i own a HC which is a fairlane and have had it for over 3 years on lpg and the only problem ive had was the injectors sh!tting themselves after 300k

[z80]

The above post is an opinion based on a petrol head forum community consensus and should not be considered as indicative of the real world.


It is a delusion to think that the majority of cars on the road are large full sized rear wheel drives.

In fact if you look around you at the lights it is almost spot the holden or ford as a rarity in some towns.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by z80

The above post is an opinion based on a petrol head forum community consensus and should not be considered as indicative of the real world.

The same can be said of the whole thread. I'll invite flappist to revisit his post in 5 and then again in 10 years time. Talk about a herd of ostriches with their heads in the ground. So the oil will last forever, I'm reassured. :togo:

[RG]

Originally Posted by new2ford

The same can be said of the whole thread. I'll invite flappist to revisit his post in 5 and then again in 10 years time. Talk about a herd of ostriches with their heads in the ground. So the oil will last forever, I'm reassured. :togo:

You obviously are a victim of the scare tactics telling you that the world is going to end / the sky is falling / global warming / global cooling / we are about to run out of oil and other such rubbish.

Maybe have a look into how much oil is left, a little research and then come back here. I'm quite sure you will find that there is a bit more oil than you think.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by RG

You obviously are a victim of the scare tactics telling you that the world is going to end / the sky is falling / global warming / global cooling / we are about to run out of oil and other such rubbish.

Maybe have a look into how much oil is left, a little research and then come back here. I'm quite sure you will find that there is a bit more oil than you think.

Perhaps you should have a good look, and also consider all the surrounding factors such as international politics and price which will all come to bear. The owners of gas cars will have the last laugh.

[RG]

Originally Posted by new2ford

Perhaps you should have a good look, and also consider all the surrounding factors such as international politics and price which will all come to bear. The owners of gas cars will have the last laugh.

I have had a good look, the future isn't as bleak as some would have us believe.

[GT]

Originally Posted by RG

You obviously are a victim of the scare tactics telling you that the world is going to end / the sky is falling / global warming / global cooling / we are about to run out of oil and other such rubbish.

Maybe have a look into how much oil is left, a little research and then come back here. I'm quite sure you will find that there is a bit more oil than you think.

While there is much propaganda with the issues you raised, the bigger issue is the enormous lift in oil products being consumed which will escalate the price and eventually run out or get to less sustainable levels. The reason for this is countries like India, China, the former USSR States are all 'new' consumers with great economies, large populations, plenty of disposable income and a hunger for cars and products that we have enjoyed for many years. They also have no regard for the environment and having lived in many of these countries for some years with the oil industry, I have seen it first hand.

LPG is a cheap form of energy and we need to start looking at how this country can self-sustain our thirst for fossil fuels. The other countries enormous fuel appetite WILL drive up the price and I will be alongside you wincing at the petrol pump in my big V8 (and still with a smile on my face!).

I drove an LPG dedicated Falcon in my last job and it was great. Went like a cut cat and I got over 600kms to a tank at a cost of around $50 (at that time). I would happily have one in the garage as a daily driver alongside the GT.

Cheers
Gaela

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by RG

Maybe have a look into how much oil is left, a little research and then come back here. I'm quite sure you will find that there is a bit more oil than you think.

Ah. Someone else who remembers the first Gulf War. When we were told by George Dubbya's Dad, and other 'Experts', that we would run out of oil in 10 years...ie :the year 2000.

[gtfpv]

flappist you have finally surprised me . thats the 1st post in a long time where you have managed not to put absolute sh it on others .
make some valid points too . however as far as only tight ***** using LPG . I DETER . most lpg users like myself are big car lovers , hence one GT in the garage , and a safe bigger work car old on lpg that can go anywhere at a moments notice ie : any car park anywhere , down a boat ramp, through a flood,into a lake or straight to the wreckers, ahh the joy of motoring freedom. rather than a little hyundi getz.

[PoweredByCNG]

So people don't like putting their kids next to a pressure vessel.

What's so different about putting their kids next to a thin plastic petrol tank? The petrol tank is infinitely more prone to explosion due to it's simple nature and the fact that petrol readily ignites compared to LPG.

People aren't interested in LPG simply because THEY DON'T KNOW. Petrol and diesel are considered 'mainstream' enough that any safety concerns are overlooked by most.

Regards,
Dave

[Mr Hardware]

Yeah Stoney you might want to look into what LPG Fumigation really is, because a lot of the points you make are moot in terms of LPG Fumigation for diesels.

Also, finally a flappist post with some acutal information and value and not just idle trolling! A lot of the points you make are right flappist, people do think that, no matter how inherently flawed their judgement is. A lot of them concentrate on the four LPG myths i posted on page 1 also.

[Stoney!]

I know what it is, I just didn't realise that's what you were talking about as I've never heard it being called that before...

However, just another expensive and complex add on that takes up space and can affect a new car warrant or warranty repairs. No way I would put this on a new car, no way.

My above points still stand In LPG v's Small capacity petrol and Turbo diesel.

Stoney!

[new2ford]

Thanks GTGTP for injecting some sense.

http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news...0803-e6is.html