Pensioners loose out - Page 3

eb_5litre · 18-01-2005, 11:54 PM

Does a Titty Bar count?

Barry_v · 18-01-2005, 11:57 PM

long term unemployment goes hand in hand with severe depression. getting knocked back so many times does get to you. If i'd been unemployed for years I'd probably have a drinking problem too.

XRQTOR · 18-01-2005, 11:57 PM

Na there Allowed, but no tips.

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry_v

long term unemployment goes hand in hand with severe depression. getting knocked back so many times does get to you. If i'd been unemployed for years I'd probably have a drinking problem too.

Probally the other way around, getting knocked back because of the drinking problem. It's only an excuse for the weak minded.

Barry_v · 19-01-2005, 12:11 AM

I'm not going to continue this arguement, you obviously need to experience the depression associated with long term unemployement so that you can get some respect for others.

MickyB · 19-01-2005, 12:25 AM

I think everyone here has some valid points, but the fact of the matter is, that in the society that we live in, we have to provide for those who are less fortunate than others. I mean where is the joy in earning 200k per year when 3 suburbs away people are struggling to feed their children.

The main thing that needs improvement in this country is the allocation of welfare, I know of students living at home, with parents on 150k plus who, because of a clause in the Youth Allowance structure, can get $215 per week from the government for doing nothing, yet a struggling student, living with a single parent gets not a dollar more. I also know of single mums who are doing the absolute best that they can to raise their children, yet are constantly finding it hard to make ends meet.

If Centrelink seriously looked at each situation on its own and analysed the person in question, rather than deeming so many people to be in the same basket, then I think that people would be a lot more content with certain people receiving welfare. I get a small amount of youth allowance from the government, but I am studying and pay tax from my other job, and I definitely plan on putting that money and more back into the system when I finish my uni course.

In the end we have to decide whether we want to live in an entirely capitalistic society and pay little tax, yet those who fall under hardship are left behind, or do we pay massive tax and have everything provided for us? I believe that in Australia we should live somewhere between, where we are rewarded for effort, yet if we genuinely fall down, then there is system to help us get us back on our feet, NOT prop us up for the rest of our lives.

TIKFD6 · 19-01-2005, 08:23 AM

MickyB thats some of the most valid point so far in this thread.
Welfare is there for a reason.

NAK302 · 19-01-2005, 09:39 AM

i've just got home from nightshift and sat down to read some interesting threads. instead i find myself having to defend what i believe in. i won't bother doing that. i find some of the PERSONAL attacks on me very distasteful and unneccessary. i read your reply to me mr mcmaster and you should be ashamed of yourself for suggesting that i'm a bit of female anatomy. mother nature, i too am divorced and had 3 children ripped out my life, i'm still paying for it 9 years on. my x is on a pension and gets a healthy amount from me as well and you are right, i am a fool for having an opinion.
see folks, everyone has a story.
at least mrs mother nature you get to see your children.

pepsimax · 19-01-2005, 10:28 AM

thanks to the guys who have shown what a careing society we live in

i am 36 and have been on the pension for four years,,but to look at me you wouldn't see why cause on the outside i look normal,,i'm with RFS and i do fight fires,and play lawn bowls and cycle every now and then,because if i didn't my spine would bind up and freeze.

you see a have a spine that is falling apart and there's nothing that can be done to stop it,,i'm in pain most of the time and sometimes i can't walk,i can't walk more than 100 metre's in one go,,i can't walk up hills,i can't lift anything over 5 kilo's,i can barely play with my daughter some times,i can't even pick her up,

but according to some on here because i can drive my car i'm not disabled.

don't go saying that the pension is a waiste of time because if i didn't get my $197.95 a week i'd be dead,,hang on that would suite some of you wouldn't it,no pensioner handout

: . you see i also have diabetes and with out the pbs i could not afford the 100 dollars a fourtnight it would cost me for my medication. i would like to work but i can't as nobody will hire a person with a bad back no matter what.

loxxr6 · 19-01-2005, 02:49 PM

The main thing that needs improvement in this country is the allocation of welfare, I know of students living at home, with parents on 150k plus who, because of a clause in the Youth Allowance structure, can get $215 per week from the government for doing nothing, yet a struggling student, living with a single parent gets not a dollar more. I also know of single mums who are doing the absolute best that they can to raise their children, yet are constantly finding it hard to make ends meet.

If Centrelink seriously looked at each situation on its own and analysed the person in question, rather than deeming so many people to be in the same basket, then I think that people would be a lot more content with certain people receiving welfare. I get a small amount of youth allowance from the government, but I am studying and pay tax from my other job, and I definitely plan on putting that money and more back into the system when I finish my uni course.

100% agree.

klawsterfobik · 19-01-2005, 04:39 PM

Firstly, i havent read the entire thread. I got too annoyed with the selfish, mindless and supremisist comments of some forum members. If these comments had have been said to my face, or in a conversation that i was involved in at the pub i would have either dropped my beer, walked away, or fallen over backwards.

The welfare system is there for a reason, to help people that need it. Agreed that some people over-use it, but there are some who refuse to use it, like me. And i wont use it until i REALLY need it.

The people who died, or lost everything including parents and loved ones in the Tsunami need aide, and fairly desperately. I was quite disappointed when i found out that of the Australian Governments $1b donation, half of that has to be repaid. Not really a donation is it?

I'm proud to say im an Aussie, so if i say i'll lend a hand to help someone who has fallen i'll make damn sure that i do. If my mate needs $20 for petrol because he lost his job, he'll get it, no questions asked.

klawsterfobik · 19-01-2005, 04:48 PM

As for the depression issue associated with losing a job. My girlfriend lost her job last Tuesday, and the difference in her was amazing. She didnt want to do anything, and slept for the majority of 2 days and went back to her old bad habbits. Thankfully this week she's getting better, looking for jobs etc, and i have finally seen a smile on her face.

But i can easily see how if she was single, and didnt have such a supportive and encouraging boyfriend (im awesome

) how things could have turned out much differently.

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry_v

I'm not going to continue this arguement, you obviously need to experience the depression associated with long term unemployement so that you can get some respect for others.

If i had bills to pay and mouths to feed i would go get a job. Any job that pays is better than none isn't it. What do you define as long term 6+ months, in your train of thought your telling me alot of people find it so hard to not get a job within 6 +months or cant they find a job they like.

As for experienceing long term depression myself, i wouldn't let it get to that stage. If i lose my job ill be out the next day looking for a new one. If needed any job as long as i can pay the bills. I have no skills, but just look in the local paper at how many places require Un skilled labour. 5o+ a week.

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MickyB

The main thing that needs improvement in this country is the allocation of welfare, I know of students living at home, with parents on 150k plus who, because of a clause in the Youth Allowance structure, can get $215 per week from the government for doing nothing, yet a struggling student, living with a single parent gets not a dollar more. I also know of single mums who are doing the absolute best that they can to raise their children, yet are constantly finding it hard to make ends meet.

Thats bullshit how can that be allowed to happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MickyB

I believe that in Australia we should live somewhere between, where we are rewarded for effort, yet if we genuinely fall down, then there is system to help us get us back on our feet, NOT prop us up for the rest of our lives.

Thats why i think there should be a time limit on the dole (Max 6 months), or better still a setup like the US where people are given food stamps that CAN NOT be used for drugs, alcohol, smokes, pay tv.

pepsimax · 19-01-2005, 06:43 PM

no, any job is not better than no job,,have you ever heard of the working poor,,they earn less than the dole.

and as for personal attacks one gets what one puts out.

the grouping of all welfare recipiants into the one basket is total bullshit and does not concider the individual that is effected.

i hope those that feel free to run people down have there 200 000 plus super put away for there future,,old age pension is waiting for you

pepsimax · 19-01-2005, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Thats bullshit how can that be allowed to happen.

Thats why i think there should be a time limit on the dole (Max 6 months), or better still a setup like the US where people are given food stamps that CAN NOT be used for drugs, alcohol, smokes, pay tv.

ok then bright spark when they are all cut off welfare they can all come and live with you in your neat and tidy house and eat your food,,better yet they can camp in your front yard and **** all over your pretty lawn.. even better they can sleep in your bed next to your mrs or ya girlfriend,,there a lot of people who can not get a job for some reason and should not be ridiculed or put down for it.

those that are lucky to have a job and still pay the rent and keep a car on the road should thank there luck stars.

theres a lot of people who work and still live hand to mouth week to week and still end up being societies forgotten majority.

why do people like you think there is a job just around the corner,for some yes but for some theres not.

your tunnel vision is being clouded by your rose coloured glasses dude,,step outside your little box and enter the real world..

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepsimax

no, any job is not better than no job,,have you ever heard of the working poor,,they earn less than the dole.

and as for personal attacks one gets what one puts out.

the grouping of all welfare recipiants into the one basket is total bullshit and does not concider the individual that is effected.

i hope those that feel free to run people down have there 200 000 plus super put away for there future,,old age pension is waiting for you

So your saying that if you faced work that paid under what the dole does you'd rather sit at home and get the dole. Im not trying to group everyone into the same basket but a large majority can be.

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepsimax

ok then bright spark when they are all cut off welfare they can all come and live with you in your neat and tidy house and eat your food,,better yet they can camp in your front yard and **** all over your pretty lawn.. even better they can sleep in your bed next to your mrs or ya girlfriend,,there a lot of people who can not get a job for some reason and should not be ridiculed or put down for it.

those that are lucky to have a job and still pay the rent and keep a car on the road should thank there luck stars.

theres a lot of people who work and still live hand to mouth week to week and still end up being societies forgotten majority.

why do people like you think there is a job just around the corner,for some yes but for some theres not.

your tunnel vision is being clouded by your rose coloured glasses dude,,step outside your little box and enter the real world..

I live in the real world mate, i see what happens. Why isn't there a job around the corner, is it a job that requires to much work or one they dont like there must be a reason.

Aaron_EF8 · 19-01-2005, 07:46 PM

XRQTOR - If bieng on the dole is so great, why don't you actually go on it for a little while, then see what its like. I'm sure you will love it, you get foxtel, you can keep the XR8, you can afford to go to the pub regularly, and all you have to do is hand in a form once a fortnight.

Have you actually gone up to every person you see in a pub and asked them if they are unemployed? Have you ever gone into every house in a 'typical welfare area' and asked them if they are actually unemployed? Stop watching a Current Affair and pull your head out of your ****ing ****.

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

So your saying that if you faced work that paid under what the dole does you'd rather sit at home and get the dole. Im not trying to group everyone into the same basket but a large majority can be.

What would you do??

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron_EF8

XRQTOR - If bieng on the dole is so great, why don't you actually go on it for a little while, then see what its like. I'm sure you will love it, you get foxtel, you can keep the XR8, you can afford to go to the pub regularly, and all you have to do is hand in a form once a fortnight.

Have you actually gone up to every person you see in a pub and asked them if they are unemployed? Have you ever gone into every house in a 'typical welfare area' and asked them if they are actually unemployed? Stop watching a Current Affair and pull your head out of your ****ing ****.

What would you do??

Firstly i dont watch that shit mate im not home from work early enough. No i havent asked each and every person but im not blind or stupid some of my mates live in h/c areas and it's simple to see how things are. When i was on holidays and we went to the local pub (Ambervale tavern for those who live in sydney) for lunch half the friggin street went. They seem to think it's fantastic that they get given free money and can go down the pub and get ****ed at 11am everyday, how do i know this well they all brag about it and give me stick for being stupid enough to work.

Me i'd take the lower paying job, i'd never go on the dole. . Im not bagging EVERYONE on the dole or EVERYONE wgo recives the pension just a seemingly larhe majority of them.

pepsimax · 19-01-2005, 08:10 PM

or just the simple fact there not bloody qualified to bloody do the job and get told to f off by the lacky in the basement,,it happens and it happens a lot..

and my oath i'd rather be on the dole and have a little bit of money to live on than work in a shit job with shit pay and pay 48c in the dollar tax then try a find a way to put food on the table,try to put petrol in the bloody car because there aint no public transport and tell my daughter she aint got no birthday presants because the doctor don't bulk bill anymore and your medicines cost more than your weekly income,

get ya hand off ya knob and realise the real world aint as nice as you'd like to think it is..

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepsimax

or just the simple fact there not bloody qualified to bloody do the job and get told to f off by the lacky in the basement,,it happens and it happens a lot..

and my oath i'd rather be on the dole and have a little bit of money to live on than work in a shit job with shit pay and pay 48c in the dollar tax then try a find a way to put food on the table,try to put petrol in the bloody car because there aint no public transport and tell my daughter she aint got no birthday presants because the doctor don't bulk bill anymore and your medicines cost more than your weekly income,

get ya hand off ya knob and realise the real world aint as nice as you'd like to think it is..

I'd love to have a shit job where i got taxed 48c per dollar, that's the highest tax bracket so that means they would be earning what $6o,ooo a year plus.

Barry_v · 19-01-2005, 08:27 PM

there must be someone else you can find to vilify other than disabled and poor people. sheesh. you should build a time machine and join a European aristocracy.

XRQTOR · 19-01-2005, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry_v

there must be someone else you can find to vilify other than disabled and poor people. sheesh. you should build a time machine and join a European aristocracy.

Have i once mentiond disabled people. EVER.

RED_EL_XR8 · 19-01-2005, 09:14 PM

Damn this thread got nasty!!

:

big_pete · 19-01-2005, 09:27 PM

what about single mothers, who cannot get a job because they have to look after their kids? and a baby sitter costs more than her job anyway?

my mum was on Full pension for almost a year and would apply for atleast 30 jobs a week, but she couldnt get one, she was either over qualified or not qualified enough. does she deserve the pension, does seh deserve to be ridiculed for not having a job and not having the money to buy christmas presents?

i think you need to open your eyes and realise that not everyone is so fortunate as you, hence why we have a welfare system.

Barry_v · 19-01-2005, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Im not bagging EVERYONE on the dole or EVERYONE wgo recives the pension just a seemingly larhe majority of them.

we were talking about people with the pension. so you're either talking about disabled people or senior citizens.

TIKFD6 · 19-01-2005, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XRQTOR

Have i once mentiond disabled people. EVER.

Not directly, but this thread started about my Girlfriend, she has a disability.
As a matter off fact i am also on a Dissability pension, but its from the Army, and i an also dissabled.

:

TIKFD6 · 19-01-2005, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nak351

i read your reply to me mr mcmaster and you should be ashamed of yourself for suggesting that i'm a bit of female anatomy. mother nature, i too am divorced and had 3 children ripped out my life, i'm still paying for it 9 years on. my x is on a pension and gets a healthy amount from me as well and you are right, i am a fool for having an opinion.
see folks, everyone has a story.
at least mrs mother nature you get to see your children.

Mate your not the only one in these circumstances, i also have 3 kids and two Ex's, one of which is living off the pension and sucking me dry, and dont get to see my kids.
So you see how i understand both sides of the story, but you dont have to be mad at the world, or those people who receive benifits from the Government.

loxxr6 · 19-01-2005, 09:47 PM

There are no shortage of jobs for people that really wanna work to get work.

It all comes down to how much you really want to work OR if you are able to work in the first place eg you have a disability.

Choosing not to work when you can, and taking the dole is not fair. If people have committments to family that prevent them from getting to a job then thats understandable too. The issue is for those who are able to do something but choose not to.

People that make no conscious effort to get themselves outta their bad situations when they are able to, need to be have their benefits reviewed.

What do people think is a fair solution to those that have no intention of working again when they can, those that are ripping hard working people off ? What do people think is the right thing to do ?