New feature Falcons should have - Page 3

madmelon · 23-02-2010, 05:59 PM

I rekon Carbon Ceramic brakes as options on whatever upper models. I know they're horrendously expensive but that's why they should be an OPTION.

...oh and 10" or 11" wide wheel option on the back. This 8" limit crap has gone on for long enough.

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 06:34 PM

Some additional comments. [defense mode on]

(1) Ford are getting quite good sales results out of their higher series models. And that's not all performance related. I have seen some colleagues cross-shop a G6ET against an Audi and a Honda. Interestingly the Falcon lost out on both, and it wasn't because of performance. And guess what, the cars that won had rain sensing wipers, auto closing boots, blinking brake lights on sudden deceleration, and heated seats. Lost sales without these features are still lost sales, despite how hard you think you are. You should also checkout the recent video's of the 2011 Mustang GT500 and see what you think of it's flashing brake lights.

(2) The victorian government is about to take shipment of 2000 Hybrid Camrys while they stop buying Fords and Holdens. Blokey V8 drivers might not care about hybrids, but they are coming whether you like it or not. Thank goodness Toyota can only build 10,000 of the things a year, because if they could build more, they'd sell more - and probably all to smug politicians. What's worse is that it appears to undercut the cheapest Prius by some $5k. How does that work? I drive a big V8 in the city. Hybrids are of as much interest to me as my exorbitant fuel cost.....

(3) If you haven't seen what a computer in your car can do, then good on ya. But in a single device you can replace sat nav, in car dvd players, blue tooth, you can store years of MP3 audio with no need for bouncing and skipping optical stacks of disks or having memory sticks of music floating around in your pockets, you can have on-demand videos ready to go so you don't have to carry around packs of DVD's, and you can add features without having to buy the big boxes to install into you car. With Nano and Pico style computers these days you'd save a heap of weight eliminating the other items. In car DVD's and GPS units are selling madly at the moment. And you can get real-time engine management data out of your car at a whim via the OBD2 port - no need to carry around dials and pressure sensors when you can touch a screen and put any info you want on the screen.

(4) Auto windows up/down requires no additional electronics or wires - just different electronics and body module programming. Rain sensing wipers requires nothing more than an additional sensor near the rear vision mirror and some programming. I like the outside world. I drive with my windows open to and from work. It would be nice to have a single-button do this for me. And it would be nice for me not to have to hold the button down to raise the window as I leave the macca's drive though. Heck, I don't need that hand to steer around little kids while I change gear in the manual now do I....

(5) Drink heater/cooler. Have you been in an upspec Toyota Prado lately? The centre console is a refrigetor. The best thing a Territory can do is an electric esky seatbelted to the back seat. Buzinga, another reason not to buy an up-spec Ford.

(6) GenZ and Ford/Holden never historically see eye to eye do they. The Turbo6 has rocked that somewhat given that most GenZers only want to deal with forced induction and high tech. It's not suprising that the Revtone concept would meet with resistance here. I'm not willing to concede the idea yet based on an 'old blokes' response to the idea. Feed it to young guys who would have otherwise looked at a lowered Excels, or guys that have Milo tins on their exhaust, exactly the kind of guys that V8 drivers deride, and let's see whether they'd give an approving nod or not.

(7) People without kids want to slap either the kids or the parents of those kids when the kids make noise on a plane. It's obviously that easy to just get kids to do as they've been asked isn't it. When you're a parent you take a different view on the that, and the things that can make your life easier. I'd rather a see-in-the-dark camera than having to drop my rear vision mirror all the time so I can see the kids having a punch up - assuming i don't already have auto dipping mirros that CAN'T be dropped, or have to turn around and risk a crash, or have to detect blown seals via my nose. That's the LEAST favoured method of detection. And the night vision and rear setbelt reminder? Geez. Obedient kids. How I wish it worked like that.

Lukeyson

dallasv8 · 23-02-2010, 08:04 PM

i would like to be able to buy a xt pack falcon and be able to option a v8,manual,brembos and sports suspension.
stuff all the other crap,leave it for the G6 series.
i would even rather be able to go and buy my own cd player to fit in the dash instead of the whole one unit thing we get lumped with now.

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 08:31 PM

So how is that different from an XR8? The colour of the trim? Or the steel rims?

Lukeyson

b2tf · 23-02-2010, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Some additional comments. [defense mode on]

(1) Ford are getting quite good sales results out of their higher series models. And that's not all performance related. I have seen some colleagues cross-shop a G6ET against an Audi and a Honda. Interestingly the Falcon lost out on both, and it wasn't because of performance. And guess what, the cars that won had rain sensing wipers, auto closing boots, blinking brake lights on sudden deceleration, and heated seats. Lost sales without these features are still lost sales, despite how hard you think you are. You should also checkout the recent video's of the 2011 Mustang GT500 and see what you think of it's flashing brake lights.

Mate I dont care if Bentleys have it, I personally reckon it is a dodgy idea. If you cannot drive safely enough that 2 big fat taillights on the back of a car don't tell you that the car is slowing down, and you need lights blinking and flashing to make it obvious, you should never have passed a driving test.

Quote:

(2) The victorian government is about to take shipment of 2000 Hybrid Camrys while they stop buying Fords and Holdens. Blokey V8 drivers might not care about hybrids, but they are coming whether you like it or not. Thank goodness Toyota can only build 10,000 of the things a year, because if they could build more, they'd sell more - and probably all to smug politicians. What's worse is that it appears to undercut the cheapest Prius by some $5k. How does that work? I drive a big V8 in the city. Hybrids are of as much interest to me as my exorbitant fuel cost.....

Never said I didnt think they were coming - they are the way of the future for sure. BUT, I personally am not convinced enough on them to the point where I would buy one. Call me old fashioned etc but I like my big fat old gas guzzling Falcon - and so do a lot of other people. How many Priuses do you see round?

Quote:

(3) If you haven't seen what a computer in your car can do, then good on ya. But in a single device you can replace sat nav, in car dvd players, blue tooth, you can store years of MP3 audio with no need for bouncing and skipping optical stacks of disks or having memory sticks of music floating around in your pockets, you can have on-demand videos ready to go so you don't have to carry around packs of DVD's, and you can add features without having to buy the big boxes to install into you car. With Nano and Pico style computers these days you'd save a heap of weight eliminating the other items. In car DVD's and GPS units are selling madly at the moment. And you can get real-time engine management data out of your car at a whim via the OBD2 port - no need to carry around dials and pressure sensors when you can touch a screen and put any info you want on the screen.

Ive got an iPod input and that keeps me happy - no doubt some people will want the gear you talk of but then refer to the post above this one - you cant even fit a CD player because the bloody things are so complicated and integrated into the dash.

Quote:

(4) Auto windows up/down requires no additional electronics or wires - just different electronics and body module programming. Rain sensing wipers requires nothing more than an additional sensor near the rear vision mirror and some programming. I like the outside world. I drive with my windows open to and from work. It would be nice to have a single-button do this for me. And it would be nice for me not to have to hold the button down to raise the window as I leave the macca's drive though. Heck, I don't need that hand to steer around little kids while I change gear in the manual now do I....

I agreed with you (and still do) on this point. Wish to hell they would put it in. My work truck has it - my $40k weekender XR8 doesnt. Something not right there.

Quote:

(5) Drink heater/cooler. Have you been in an upspec Toyota Prado lately? The centre console is a refrigetor. The best thing a Territory can do is an electric esky seatbelted to the back seat. Buzinga, another reason not to buy an up-spec Ford.

Territory maybe - Falcon I dont think so.

Quote:

(6) GenZ and Ford/Holden never historically see eye to eye do they. The Turbo6 has rocked that somewhat given that most GenZers only want to deal with forced induction and high tech. It's not suprising that the Revtone concept would meet with resistance here. I'm not willing to concede the idea yet based on an 'old blokes' response to the idea. Feed it to young guys who would have otherwise looked at a lowered Excels, or guys that have Milo tins on their exhaust, exactly the kind of guys that V8 drivers deride, and let's see whether they'd give an approving nod or not.

You will never convince me of the benefits of a car that sounds like something that it is not. Bulge bonnets on 6 cyls etc etc all over again.

Quote:

(7) People without kids want to slap either the kids or the parents of those kids when the kids make noise on a plane. It's obviously that easy to just get kids to do as they've been asked isn't it. When you're a parent you take a different view on the that, and the things that can make your life easier. I'd rather a see-in-the-dark camera than having to drop my rear vision mirror all the time so I can see the kids having a punch up - assuming i don't already have auto dipping mirros that CAN'T be dropped, or have to turn around and risk a crash, or have to detect blown seals via my nose. That's the LEAST favoured method of detection. And the night vision and rear setbelt reminder? Geez. Obedient kids. How I wish it worked like that.

The last 40 years or so seem to have worked out ok with parents being able to maybe pull off the road to sort the kids out. Its another tech feature that would likely cost a bomb to implement and not recoup the profit - I wouldnt buy it.

aussie muscle · 23-02-2010, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xtremerus

Just a thought, why would you want heated seats in Brisbane

because if it gets below 20°, they think it's going to snow.

:

**DJM83** · 23-02-2010, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

I'm just wondering if all the people asking for heated seats have ever sat in a Falcon after it's been parked on a 35+ deg day?

I agree mate but ive also sat in a falcon with leather as have you after its been minus 5 or 6 degrees its not pleasant but it still doesnt justify heated seats.

But yes 35 degrees plus leather seats = FAIL

madmelon · 23-02-2010, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

I agree mate but ive also sat in a falcon with leather as have you after its been minus 5 or 6 degrees its not pleasant but it still doesnt justify heated seats.

But yes 35 degrees plus leather seats = FAIL

So seat heating and seat cooling then?

b2tf · 23-02-2010, 09:39 PM

I fear I may be missing the point here but is there really nothing better to come up with other than some form of temperature control in the seats?!

Come on, there are loads more useful things that could and should be incorporated into these cars.

madmelon · 23-02-2010, 09:45 PM

SPEED LIMITING! As in what Mercedes has- you set a speed you don't want the car to exceed and it doesn't exceed it on acceleration. Could also tie in with cruise control using the brakes to not coast more than 2km/h above the set speed. Both have proven to be very useful features for me on the odd occasion I've driven recent Mercs.

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 09:51 PM

Nice response. Worthy of another follow up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Mate I dont care if Bentleys have it, I personally reckon it is a dodgy idea. If you cannot drive safely enough that 2 big fat taillights on the back of a car don't tell you that the car is slowing down, and you need lights blinking and flashing to make it obvious, you should never have passed a driving test..

I see. Big open country roads with no traffic - I can see why country drivers would have no reason to need it. But the ability to tell the difference between a car decelerating gently and one triggering ABS activation because of a traffic jam in front of them does make a difference to the vast majority of drivers who commute in busy traffic. This is not new stuff - it's common now on cars from Europe and in the US with big highways and heavy congestion. Heck, I'm not even sure why the safety argument is even up for debate here. Were you around to provide resistance to the high-mount stoplight as well?

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Never said I didnt think they were coming - they are the way of the future for sure. BUT, I personally am not convinced enough on them to the point where I would buy one. Call me old fashioned etc but I like my big fat old gas guzzling Falcon - and so do a lot of other people. How many Priuses do you see round?

The guy across the road from where I live owns one actually. And I pass several on my daily commute. Where exactly do you live so that you don't see them? They're not obscured by burnout tyre smoke are they?

Hey, I don't want to give up my V8 either. I just want it to use less fuel in city traffic when the thing is hardly being used for what it was designed for. I'd rather a baby hybrid feature in my V8 than have no V8 at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Ive got an iPod input and that keeps me happy - no doubt some people will want the gear you talk of but then refer to the post above this one - you cant even fit a CD player because the bloody things are so complicated and integrated into the dash.

Sorry. A CD Player? You want a CD Player instead of a CarPC? OK, you win.

:

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Territory maybe - Falcon I dont think so.

Same thing. The Territory brakes, HIM and instrument cluster in my BA XR8 tell me that. The more interchangeable parts they make the better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

You will never convince me of the benefits of a car that sounds like something that it is not. Bulge bonnets on 6 cyls etc etc all over again.

Yep, have to agree with that. Stickers on XR's, FPV badges on XT's. No argument from me. But then lots of people do it despite the fact that both you and I turn our noses up at it. So do we ignore that market out of good sense or spite?

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

The last 40 years or so seem to have worked out ok with parents being able to maybe pull off the road to sort the kids out. Its another tech feature that would likely cost a bomb to implement and not recoup the profit - I wouldnt buy it.

Yeah, and the years before that they had horses and carriages, and they never had microwave ovens or computers. I'm a bit lost with finding your point. The reverse camera module is already an option on the FG. An in-cabin camera is just another input. So if they get return on investment for the reverse camera why is the in-cabin camera so hard to do? Once I'd installed a reverse camera in my BA, it cost me $30 off eBay to buy another camera and wire it up in the cabin. I just bet they'd make a profit selling that off for another $500.

And it's OK. The "option" bit means we won't make you buy it.

Is there a term for someone who insists that the old ways are best, and that we should never look for new and better ways to do things? Other than Luddite?

Lukeyson

Road_Warrior · 23-02-2010, 10:01 PM

I think you will find that tail light modulators are illegal in Australia.

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 10:06 PM

You could be right. Especially aftermarket. Like putting LED running lights or mirror indicators on a car not approved to run them.

What would need clarification is whether OEM fitted they would still be illegal. Then again Ford released ba Fairmonts with illegal driving lights....

Lukeyson

G6ET8U · 23-02-2010, 10:26 PM

Loving the Lukeyson vs B2ft war...

Heated seats I will and always will say fail on and I live in Melbourne. Cold in winter. ICC tells me that it's 0c outside. Still wear shorts to work. Just start the car and run the heater before I go... hard? No.

Rain sensing wipers I can see a point for those... only because I am lazy.

Car PC's will be here soon enough. Think 10 years ago... why on earth would I want the internet on my phone? If you now have it... I bet you wonder how you didn't do without it before now.

I too vote for the actual premium stereo. It should be standard on G6E and FPV. Option on lower models.

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 10:26 PM

Hey, on the topic of reverse camera converters (and it's not a war, it's a lively conversation!):

* Power Out/Video In jacks at the rear of cars fitted with Reverse Camera - combined with the ability to switch this rear camera input on all the time. Thus, when towing a large boat or caravan, the fitment of an external camera on the caravan or boat and hooking into the display means I don't have to have those extended mirrors scratching my car when heavy towing, and I can see accurately what is directly behind me or attempting to overtake.

Hey, like I said, I've got this guff already and have used it like this. It's so useful my father even had me install it into his Kia Sorrento, and the missus fairly demanded it be put into her Territory....

Lukeyson

Joe5619 · 23-02-2010, 10:34 PM

I got one.. Put the cup holders in a place where the driver can use them & still change gears!! The ones in the FG are useless, put a drink in the drivers side one & you can't get to the gear stick properly.. Who ever desgined that is just plain dumb, dumb, dumb. How something like that (even though small) can get passed a drawing is mazing..

XR6TCraig · 23-02-2010, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

Maybe because I do on-call work and often get called out at early hours of the morning.. in winter, sitting on leather seats certainly makes downstairs pucker up - a quick flick and your nether regions are warm within a minute.

Perhaps when you get called out in the middle of the night, you could get dressed before sitting on your cold leather seats. This should stop the puckering!

BA Baracus · 23-02-2010, 10:40 PM

should have a flux capacitor

**Luke Plaizier** · 23-02-2010, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BA Baracus

should have a flux capacitor

We have a winner....

Either that or make 'unpainted stainless steel with gullwing doors' an FPV option box.

Lukeyson

G6ET8U · 23-02-2010, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Hey, on the topic of reverse camera converters (and it's not a war, it's a lively conversation!):

* Power Out/Video In jacks at the rear of cars fitted with Reverse Camera - combined with the ability to switch this rear camera input on all the time. Thus, when towing a large boat or caravan, the fitment of an external camera on the caravan or boat and hooking into the display means I don't have to have those extended mirrors scratching my car when heavy towing, and I can see accurately what is directly behind me or attempting to overtake.

Hey, like I said, I've got this guff already and have used it like this. It's so useful my father even had me install it into his Kia Sorrento, and the missus fairly demanded it be put into her Territory....

Lukeyson

My current model FSR-850 Isuzu 8T truck has 3 inputs for 'reverse' cameras.

Stock I have the one that sits over the barn doors on the back. It also provides for side cameras on both sides.

I know it isn't a war... but I like it either way.

Please tell me what is SYNC?

I just want my iPhone to sync with my ICC in my G6E Turbo... but it doesn't I have to choose between airplane mode.

xtremerus · 24-02-2010, 12:23 AM

Jesus, we are getting a lazy lot.
I want my favorite armchair to be able to slot into where the drivers seat is, stuff Recaros.
I do want that cruise control that slows down, if the car in front is slower than me. Otherwise I might be woken up if I hit him in the boot because i was having a snooze.
I want all the cameras possible that is showing what is going on BEHIND me, 'cos I know that the drivers behind me are probably not paying attention to what is going on in front of them.
I would really love a PS compatible center screen that is active while driving, as driving is such a bore.
As for the heated seats, I just pass wind if it is too cold.
Just thought of another one for the wish list, hose-out interior

Stoney! · 24-02-2010, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Personally I've never see any car have auto up!! I would have thought there is a safe issue with that.. Figures, neck, head, god knows what kids could get stick. Is there any car in the world with auto up? Not something I'd want on my car to be honest.. It's dangerous.

My golf has Auto up/down, and on every window not just the drivers.

Not to mention:-
*rain sensing wipers
*Mirror dip on reverse
(even Commodores have the last 2)
*Support for DAB+
*Tyre pressure monitoring
*Video in ports/USB ports/AUX IN ports.
*Auto lights off/Delay lights when lock/Lights on when unlock (I'm pretty sure falcons do this as commdores do.)
ect ect, and what ever else you guys were asking for lol.

Yeh Camp Aussie really does need to get with the times, the reason why I went for a smaller car with more features this time around..

Stoney!

Joe5619 · 24-02-2010, 07:46 AM

I'm liking the idea of "mirror dip on reverse"!!

There is alot of smart people put there to think of all these things

OzJavelin · 24-02-2010, 08:16 AM

How about the option to de-option cars; i.e. buy a V8 or T6 in a base model with a "package" (eg. suspension, driveline options, etc).

I know this isn't how the car industry works anymore, but I'm just amused that we live in what everyone calls a consumer society, but can't option cars like was possible 40years ago ..

whales · 24-02-2010, 08:21 AM

Anything that Holden don't already have. Ford always seem to be 18 months behind Holden with new technology or gimmicks. Here are some examples - 6 speed autos as standard, direct injection, AFM, and if you go back in time IRS, RTS, Airbags just to name a few

EgoFG · 24-02-2010, 09:36 AM

This is just one in a list of many I once put together.

My 1988 Skyline had a light on the dash that came on if any of my lights was not working.
(Brakes/parkers iirc)

At the time is seemed most Falcons and commodores had at least one rear light out, and I reckon it impacted not only safety but the perception of quality.

**Luke Plaizier** · 24-02-2010, 10:07 AM

Grrr.

* How about a scrolling reverse text LCD panel in the upper windscreen that faces the car in front, that scrolls the text 'KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING' or 'PLEASE KEEP UP TO THE CAR IN FRONT OF YOU' or 'PLEASE STOP DRIVING BELOW THE SPEED LIMIT' - all at the press of a button.

It seems the middle finger doesn't work as well and has some minor misinterpretations...

Lukeyson

**Luke Plaizier** · 24-02-2010, 10:34 AM

Oh, and for those asking, here's some info on Ford Sync.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Sync
http://www.fordvehicles.com/technology/sync/

And a site that offers some hope that it's coming soon to Ford Oz:
http://www.ford.com.au/servlet/Conte...YPage&site=FOA

Lukeyson

Wally · 24-02-2010, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EgoFG

This is just one in a list of many I once put together.

My 1988 Skyline had a light on the dash that came on if any of my lights was not working.
(Brakes/parkers iirc)

At the time is seemed most Falcons and commodores had at least one rear light out, and I reckon it impacted not only safety but the perception of quality.

My wife's CD JSII Vectra had a message come up on the LCD, warning which lamp was malfunctioning, which sensor was faulty, etc. I reckon it could guess a person's weight, it had so much information available. And that was ten years ago.

**Luke Plaizier** · 24-02-2010, 11:13 AM

Ahh, lights and wiring. That brings me to this next one:

* LIN (Local Interconnect Network)

I couldn't help noticing that the FG has introduced the first instance of the LIN bus to the body control module. At the moment it only does the Alarm, but if done right, it could save quite some weight in the car in the future - and make the electronics more reliable as well.

Each target "component" would only need two wires - one for Power, and one for Earth. Where a component has local earth, this would drop to just a single wire. The commands to turn these "Components" on or off (Or in fact any other function that a component provides) are carried on the Power line (Called DC-LIN)

Why is this useful? Well, you could run just one Power line around multiple components, instead of unique wires per component. So for example all your indicators, brakes, parkers, reverse, driving, interior and headlights could all be fed by just one Power and Earth pair of wires daisy chained through each component, and digital messaging used to select which individual light is turned on or off - and feed back a digital message if an individual light has failed.

Currently lights are for the most part individually fed either from the Body Control Module or the Instrument Cluster - you'd shave a few kilo's there and then, especially with those long runs to rear tail light clusters. Not to mention reducing the size of the major harness connectors.

All the windows could be fed by just one Power and Earth. No more need to run that crazy 3-fat-wires-per-window harness for central or per-window control. In fact the door locks, the windows, the power mirrors with memory and mirror dip, the door courtesy lights, the mirror indicators - all could be fed by a single Positive/Earth pair. That fat cable bundle that goes through the door spine grommet and up the side of the car would virtually disappear.

LIN is a natural fit for the existing CAN system that's been in place since the BA Falcon. To be honest I think virtually eliminating the car's wiring harness in favour of a LIN solution is just a matter of time.

Lukeyson