Motor February - VE Pics

[Brute6]

The reason for the 17's as the base rim size is for the upgraded brakes that have been developed for the car. Being a much heavier car, they need larger diameter brakes to haul the thing up. :hihi: I agree with the headlights very similar to the BA, but to me, it's gonna be a tough looking car....(in the Performance cars at least) Ford will still have their work cut out. And with the weight gain, the performance of the two will become very similar :evil3:

[Falcon Freak]

I hope that the Orion project does not result in a substantional weight increase over the BA/BF. If Ford could keep the weight the same or even reduce some fat it'll mean that the VE will be heavier then the equivalent Falcon. Which is what is really hurting Ford at the moment as the BA/BFs weight bluntens the performance and increases the fuel cosumption.

FF

[Des]

Sounds like GMH might finally be engineering some refinement into the things. Be very interesting to see if it's stacks up to the benchmark.

[SSBUB]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Can't they design a front end that looks different to every other model from the past 5 years. Grille, lights and bumper look the same as VZ, with Monaro fogs tacked on and the spoiler looks like VZ too. Get some fresh ideas Holden. Roof profile and back door windows look like it has been taken from BA.

ummmm buddy......BF? :



I reserve judgement until i see it in the flesh uncovered. :lookedat:

[Des]

Originally Posted by SSBUB

ummmm buddy......BF? :

BF is an update on BA. VE is a whole new chassis and car, not an update on the VZ (which is the final update of the family started with the VN). :

[smoo]

That front shot of the Executive reminds me of the Viva...



Oops, I meant this one 4: :

[seano14]

i dunno but when i see the pic of the VE from the side it keeps reminding me of one of them newish nissan maxima 's. i guess mainly the high waist line, roof and window shape.

[Falcon Freak]

I don't like the high waistline look which most recent new car releases have incorporated into their designs. I hope Orion bucks this trend.

FF

[DailyDriver]

It does seem to have some elemenst of BA/BF & VZ, but Holden can't risk bringing in a brand new model that looks completely different & maybe aleinating some of it buyers.

When the BA came out they looked just like the VX/VY versions, especially when I parked next to a hyper yellow colored Falcon....ALL Aussie-made cars share similar looks just a different badge at the front!

[Abacus]

Originally Posted by bathurst77

That hoop roof is very AU/BA (and that was one the things really criticised about au at first).

I agree with other writers have said that while the AU shape was a radical at the time, if it were released today it would hardly raise an eyebrow. That general shape is mainstream now.

Some have argued that Ford should have released something like a BA shape first, then followed it up with something like the AU.

The high, sloping roof has been adopted by many, if not most, new releases of the past few years. Certain Mercedes Benz models now have a back end that looks more than a little bit similar to the AU.

Ford stuffed up big time with the AU Forte, and its toothy grille and ridiculous wheel covers. Unfortunately, when you mention AU, that's the model that immediately comes to mind to non Fordies, and motoring journalists in particular. The rest of the car is not so notable these days because industry styling trends have generally gone in that direction.

[Valknutr]

Im sorry but i dont like it sits to high for me and the front part looks really compact.
Plus all these comments about it taking stylings from the BA, ford and holden have been looking more and more like twins over the past few years its not funny and its annoying me. :jab:

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by SSBUB

ummmm buddy......BF? :



I reserve judgement until i see it in the flesh uncovered. :lookedat:

The BF's a facelift of a 3 year old model, not a whole new car that still has the same looking front end from an old model from 5 years ago. Put it in perspective.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by gmhdriver

After reading some of your posts on here it is obvious that you would say anything just to degrade a Holden. Ever heard the term "credit where it's due?" Sure it may look like a VZ but thats the whole purpose of the disguise...Wait till you see the finished product before passing judgements.

I think these spy shots/photoshops are closer to the real thing than any we've seen before. They certainly look much better than Wheels' mediocre efforts.
IMO the blue VE in the pic looks awesome. If that is anything to go by then there are some great times ahead for Holden fans.

Most people agree, the VE front end doesn't look much different from VZ, but with an AU/BA roof line and well. Whats the problem with saying that. I didn't say it was crap did I, I just said what I thought and I think Holden need to try something new, not just rehashing the same old stuff. If you don't like criticism of Holden then what are you doing on a Ford site. If you want everyone to agree with you then go over to LS1.

[nb_351]

that looks like a new astra, vectra style s***box... all the same, a lot like that torana they had, i think they saw peoples reaction to it and thought, hmmm we can make a commodore out of that... hope they do it in pink lol

[Iphido]

I think its going to be a nice looking car..

But very simular to BF.. I wonder where the innovation and selling points are for VE..

[ltd]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Most people agree, the VE front end doesn't look much different from VZ, but with an AU/BA roof line and well. Whats the problem with saying that. I didn't say it was crap did I, I just said what I thought and I think Holden need to try something new, not just rehashing the same old stuff. If you don't like criticism of Holden then what are you doing on a Ford site. If you want everyone to agree with you then go over to LS1.

Good call. However, as the mods will say "this is a site for everyone" however, I agree that people getting touchy over others opinion of a commodore is a bit childish.

Anyway, if people want to get offended by non objective criticism; try this on for size.
In keeping with tradition of naming their cars after the naval and political theme - Commodore, Director, executive, senator, the new holden has been named the "Rear Admiral".

[Falcon Freak]

Originally Posted by ltd

In keeping with tradition of naming their cars after the naval and political theme - Commodore, Director, executive, senator, the new holden has been named the "Rear Admiral".

:sm_headba :thebirds:

If they can't handle criticism of the Commonbore then they shouldn't visit this forum.

FF

[ED Classic]

Originally Posted by Falcon Freak

No as the ZF six speed is too expensive to fit to all models. The 4 speed auto will disappear in 2008 and the new box will have an extra cog.

FF

If Commodore gets 6 Auto though Ford will have to compete. I think given there is already a slightly lower spec developed for the NA 6 it would a)not have been worth developing this just for Fairmont Ghia 190 b) An all new box would be more to develop than using the one already developed even if it were just a 5 speed.

I dont think it will be std on XT but it will work its way down from the Ghia soon even as an option its just a question of if they will do it before the next Falcon.

[Falcon Freak]

Say what you like but they are the facts (as they currently stand).

FF

[Lukeyson]

see the executive has the exhaust tip on the right hand side, not passenger ? unless they flipped the image

[Brute6]

That was one of the first things I noticed......

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by Abacus

Some have argued that Ford should have released something like a BA shape first, then followed it up with something like the AU.

I agree with much of what you have said. ie
The shape now 'fits in',
Rear of the new CLS Mercedes is a dead ringer (even at up to $250k)
The progression styling wise from EF to BA to AU would have made much more sense.

Anyway back to VE, it's potentially quite a good looking car. Hasn't strayed too far from the successful VT based cars and adopted many of the quality design cues of the BF too.

Of concern to Holden and delight to me is the prospect of up to 230kg weight increase. I wonder how they will hide the true weight this time? Remembering that Holden were bagging Ford to the media about bringing in a heavier car, whilst understating by up to 50kg on some models their own by not including fluids or the aircon which isn't standard in executive (Motor did a weighbridge comparison) whilst Ford were in fact overstating by up to 20kg.

It's obvious though that they have had to engineer some actual refinement (like a BF) and increase the weight in the front end etc (Motor and Wheels both acknowledge the VZ is at least a generation behind in this regard.)

The base model won't increase this much as they will be adopting the basic rear end which will be about 20kg lighter and won't have as many of the electrics either. So a 175-200kg increase is on the cards. They'll need the 5spd auto standard. No choice at 1750kgs/340Nm.

At present the Ford is about 104kg to 150kg heavier. So it looks like at this stage the Falcon will have a handy 80-100kg advantage. This is without alloy motors too.

Looked on the web and found some information on the modular motors.
This was off the Mustang and Fords site
4.6 and 5.4 Weights
4.6 SOHC 500 lbs (227kg)
4.6 DOHC 425 lbs (aluminium block) (193kg)
5.4 SOHC 525 lbs (239kg)
5.4 DOHC 540 lbs (245kg)
NB unsure if this is with or without ancillaries.

ie difference between SOHC/DOHC 5.4L is the 4v heads add 15lb.
Therefore it's clear that there is at least a 90lb reduction available. ie 41kg.

The tables could well and truly be turned!!! Please Ford give us an alloy block boss motor and barra motor too!

[phat_stak_tipa]

Its basically the smae bloody car as they got know sticky tapeand weird paint cant hide basic shape,form AU to BA the whole front and rear changed form vz to ve aint much changed more weight coz they realise ford still whoop em eventhough they are heavier or maybe its coz they finally might make the interior a nice place to be and bring build quality up to ford standard long live the blue oval via the BA revival

[outback_ute]

History repeats - the VT was 175kg heavier than the VS

[The G6ET Spot]

Originally Posted by Falcon Freak

Headlight shape looks distinctly BA!

FF

My thought exactly, plus rear door suspisiously like an AU and the rear like a mitsubishi 380. How groundbreaking!!!!!!!

[MethodX]

What do u expect?

An Au 1 Forte?

[ltd]

Guys, the new "Rear Admiral" (see my earlier post) will still be a serious contender. The weight might bring some of the fleet market back to ford, as well as Holden having less of a margin in the car and hence not be able to discount as much; but even still it will sell. In a way, Holden have given a free kick to Ford, who now have to come up with something better, more inspirational in order to regain no.1 status.
Ford are already commited to next years car, being 18 months away means they can play with the appearance in order to pip Holden. In a way, you could say Holden has sought of prematurely ejac.... er, exhibited their car.
Criticizing things like the wheels is a bit ridiculous, considering Ford will probably do the same thing on the new model next year - and the good thing here is if the tyres are the same size then they are cheaper for the consumer when they need replacement.
Ford will probably always maintain a lead over Holden in the pricing of spares, as Holden like to reward their loyal customers with exhorbitant prices on everything.
So all in all, if this new model is a copy of everything else then the consumer will most likely see past it. On top of that, the diehards were always going to buy Holden anyway so there's no point trying to convince them.

[SSBUB]

Originally Posted by phat_stak_tipa

Its basically the smae bloody car as they got know sticky tapeand weird paint cant hide basic shape,form AU to BA the whole front and rear changed form vz to ve aint much changed more weight coz they realise ford still whoop em eventhough they are heavier or maybe its coz they finally might make the interior a nice place to be and bring build quality up to ford standard long live the blue oval via the BA revival

wow yur fooly sik bro :

[phat_stak_tipa]

so much hostility ssbub fooly sick bro hahahahahaha seems like thats all u got im not a wog so doesnt offend just shows how easy it to ark u up

[Bossxr8]

Adding all the extra weight is not a good thing for Holden, petrol prices aren't going to drop any time time soon and increasing consumption may well be a disaster for them, i'm sure the fleets wouldn't be too happy if the economy was worse. Ford have the advantage here as they would have been aware of the high petrol prices early enough to make sure fuel economy would be a priority, as would bringing weight down to help this. Lets hope the new Falcon is lighter which will really give Holden a good kick in the goolies.