Another End of an Era: Last of the small RWD BMW's

[Sprintey]

Very well written article by Curt Dupriez describing the current 125i as both the end of an era of enthusiasts' small RWD BMWs, and a fine drive to boot:

http://www.caradvice.com.au/369189/2...w-125i-review/

It's becoming apparent we're not just losing Falcon/Territory/Commodore, there are other RWD/AWD platforms going the way of the dodo until resurrected in electric form.

[Express]

Buy a 2 series coupe and be done with it.

[Vesper Martini]

1 Series? its not like its been around for that long

[Maka]

I think the makers are all reserving rwd for the uber expensive upmarket only, time will tell hey...

cheer's, Maka

[Wretched]

Alfa is moving to a RWD platform right?

[outback_ute]

The Alfa Giulia will be similar to the BMW 3-series, which is 100kg+ heavier than the 1-series. Which itself is a lot heavier than the old model 1-series. The 1 & 2-series seem to be a bit of a sweet spot as a compact, relatively light car.

I'm not sure what they will do with the 2-series (the coupe 2-series not the fwd hatchback 2-series; how broken is BMW's naming system???) if they drop the 1-series it is based off, or shares the platform of.

[DFB FGXR6]

BMW seem to be in the wilderness at the moment. It seems that most of what made the brand unique has been eroded to the point that the most "BMW" thing about the brand is the badge on the bonnet.

BMW was know to be a brand that delivered fine handling cars, mostly sedans and coupes. Crisp steering, firm but controlled suspension, subtly aggressive styling, responsive revvy engines were all trademarks of a BMW. The "Ultimate Driving Machine".

And while all companies must adapt to suit the market, there is no way a front wheel drive family hatch with a 3 cylinder engine (2 Series Active Tourer) or a hulking diesel SUV (X5/X6) can be labelled an Ultimate Driving Machine. Core models like the 3 series and the manic high revving M cars are shadows of their once great selves.

In the quest to expand the brand and appeal to the masses they have diluted the brands once core attributes to the point that people choose a BMW for the badge rather than what made the brand famous.

Its kinda weird that one of their cheapest models, the 2 Series Coupe, is actually their best model.

[FPV GTHO]

Originally Posted by outback_ute

how broken is BMW's naming system???

Can't be as bad as Mercedes new system.

[Bossxr8]

And it seems every road test I read on BMW and they get panned for horribly inconsistent steering and harsh ride, mostly from run flat tyres. And they only come good once you option up the full dynamic drive packages with adaptive shocks etc. No coincidence those packs are pretty expensive too.

The "ultimate driving machine" mantra is just horse poo now. The M models are the exception, but they don't have run flats.

[new2ford]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

And it seems every road test I read on BMW and they get panned for horribly inconsistent steering and harsh ride, mostly from run flat tyres. And they only come good once you option up the full dynamic drive packages with adaptive shocks etc. No coincidence those packs are pretty expensive too.

The "ultimate driving machine" mantra is just horse poo now. The M models are the exception, but they don't have run flats.

There is usually a big discrepancy between press reviews and reality you experience when you get in the car - as Ford fans know well.

And run flats (at least the ones BMW uses) are little different from conventional tyres.

[Express]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

And it seems every road test I read on BMW and they get panned for horribly inconsistent steering and harsh ride, mostly from run flat tyres. And they only come good once you option up the full dynamic drive packages with adaptive shocks etc. No coincidence those packs are pretty expensive too.

The "ultimate driving machine" mantra is just horse poo now. The M models are the exception, but they don't have run flats.

I can’t talk for all BMW models only the ones I’ve driven and in particular mine and I find the suspension setup is just as important as the choice between run flats or not and that goes for the SUV’s as well.

My 135i has had run flats since the day I brought it home (always Bridgestone Potenza RE050A RFT) and I find the ride is harsh over rough roads compared to a VE Commodore SS on stock tyres and also noisy but being someone whose daily cars mainly run on 20 inch rims with low profile rubber I’m used to both those properties.

What I do notice is the 135i laughs at my Commodore even though it’s lowered on 20 inch (255 & 285) Pirelli P Zeros when it comes to turning in on a tight bend.

The smooth turn in and follow on of the 135i even on run flats is chalk and cheese to most of the other cars I have and it takes coilovers and very soft tyres to match it.

I’ve been told by the dealership if I swap them out it will have a softer quieter ride but the handling improvement will only be slight and hard to notice and as I’ve recently driven my brother-in-law’s new M4 I’d have to agree.

His car certainly has more muscle but it didn’t feel any better in the bends.

Not that I’ll ever get to experience the change as my wife won’t allow it.

She wants the peace of mind the run flats give her as she knows she can drive it home and have me arrange for the tyre to be repaired or as I’ve found in the past once you drive on them flat repair is not usually an option, replacement is needed.

[4vxc]

I drove a 118i a couple of weeks ago, pretty disappointing
no room and no power

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by 4vxc

I drove a 118i a couple of weeks ago, pretty disappointing
no room and no power

What were you expecting, the 118 is the base model, 100kw.
No different to a Focus, Mazda 3, Corolla, Golf, etc. Power comes in up further in the range.

The 1 series is hatch back with RWD, it isn't going to fit 3 baby seats, tow a caravan and rip record 0-100 runs at the same time just like a Falcon.

[4vxc]

I expected it would be a match for the Mazda 3

[Wretched]

Originally Posted by 4vxc

I expected it would be a match for the Mazda 3

In what area?

According to the specs they are only mm different in some areas.
http://forms.bmw.com.au/media/BMW/br...AT_215_AUS.pdf
http://www.mazda.com.au/assets/cars/...l-brochure.pdf

The 118i in the BMW is a 3cylinder turbo 100kw and Mazda is 2.0 NA 114kw.
On paper not too much in it.

[Ruination]

Originally Posted by DFB FGXR6

BMW seem to be in the wilderness at the moment. It seems that most of what made the brand unique has been eroded to the point that the most "BMW" thing about the brand is the badge on the bonnet.

BMW was know to be a brand that delivered fine handling cars, mostly sedans and coupes. Crisp steering, firm but controlled suspension, subtly aggressive styling, responsive revvy engines were all trademarks of a BMW. The "Ultimate Driving Machine".

And while all companies must adapt to suit the market, there is no way a front wheel drive family hatch with a 3 cylinder engine (2 Series Active Tourer) or a hulking diesel SUV (X5/X6) can be labelled an Ultimate Driving Machine. Core models like the 3 series and the manic high revving M cars are shadows of their once great selves.

In the quest to expand the brand and appeal to the masses they have diluted the brands once core attributes to the point that people choose a BMW for the badge rather than what made the brand famous.

Its kinda weird that one of their cheapest models, the 2 Series Coupe, is actually their best model.

"Business"
Overrules everything unfortunately.

[4vxc]

Originally Posted by Wretched

In what area?

According to the specs they are only mm different in some areas.
http://forms.bmw.com.au/media/BMW/br...AT_215_AUS.pdf
http://www.mazda.com.au/assets/cars/...l-brochure.pdf

The 118i in the BMW is a 3cylinder turbo 100kw and Mazda is 2.0 NA 114kw.
On paper not too much in it.

overall feel of perceived quality was not a match for Mazda, it was very small inside regardless of what the specs say they really feel small.
I have had a few 6cyl 3 series BMW's they were great cars but in the 1 series I cant see the point of rwd.
I didn't rev it out as it was a customer's car but I get to drive a lot of different makes and models all the time and it never takes long to get a quick impression of a car when you drive them all on the same roads

[Sprintey]

I wonder if the 2 series coupe will continue as a driver's RWD while the hatch/sedan go FWD?

I quite like the hatch myself Express, but I understand many going for the coupe (2 door hatch my favourite).

If we go back to the original LC-LJ Torana of the early 1970s, or the original 3 series and its continuation throughout the 1980s, we again see that "drivers' small RWD, big engine" combination - that's the bit that might be "end of an era". Is there anything else out there internationally with this kind of setup?

Joy of joys, a lot of the electric news from Tesla or Audi is cars that are RWD with smaller front motors giving AWD capability.

[outback_ute]

Originally Posted by FPV GTHO

Can't be as bad as Mercedes new system.

I'd disagree, at least the the M-B one doesn't have the same name on two different vehicles. The new system matches their SUV to their equivalent sedan/hatch, at the expense of throwing away the equity in names like the ML that had been around for 20 years or so.

Runflats seem to have improved a lot since their introduction, likewise it seems that since models were renewed and intended to have runflats from the start things work better. I'm not sure they are really better than a spare tyre, and I wonder how much weight is saved when the tyres are heavier.

[new2ford]

The good run flats nowadays don't have any impact on ride quality. Ours has Pirellis. I've experienced the practical side - a screw through a tyre at only 5000 k

It was on a two lane busy highway. If it was a normal tyre my wife would simply call the road service, there's no way she could change it. I'm getting arthritic and losing my taste for jobs like changing wheels, so it was great to be able to drive back home. I was amazed how little effect it had on the car's handling at 80 km/h.

The problem in Australia is that outside the capital cities the average tyre shop isn't going to carry your specific run flat and there'll be a two day wait for delivery. So what I do is keep a tyre in the garage and pick it up and run down to the tyre place with it and then order another one for the garage while they fit the one I've brought. Any tyre place can fit the tyre. The tyres are a bit darn expensive but I guess that's the price of that extra convenience.

If it's a remote area trip I'd put the tyre in the boot (but lose some luggage space obviously). If the manufacturers used their brains about their export (non European) market they'd create a well to store a tyre under the boot. It wouldn't be that hard and there wouldn't really be a weight argument (if there is anyway).

[sprintman1]

Swapped out the suspension on my E46 manual coupe and it was quite a drive. They are still in demand if in good condition

[Feathers]

The '05 130i Msport I drove in Europe recently wasn't a bad piece of kit. The owner took it out for a few laps on a track in Finland, and it handled itself quite well, though he wasn't taking it easy. It did rip the front tyres to shreds in ~12 laps though.

It was more than comfortable for our 6-700km per day, 10 day road trip, and we had quite a bit of luggage, but I'm not going to rush out and buy one. I'm just not the hatchback kind of girl.
I don't mind the look of the coupe though.

[Angeldust]

I've decided to keep my e46 coupe.. Parents bought it new in 2002, even though its still 'mums' I mostly drive it as a 2nd car. Its done 231,000k's now and its holding up well, should easily get another 10 years out of it. Over time it has grown on me, and I respect its handling and quality compared to my VZ.

[new2ford]

I came across this. Priceless!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTMAFD_hpRw